Solving for degenerate oscillatory modes for three connected particles

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the dynamics of three connected particles described by a Lagrangian framework. Participants are tasked with deriving equations of motion, exploring angular momentum in specific modes, and identifying degenerate oscillatory modes under certain conditions.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the derivation of the Lagrangian and the resulting equations of motion. There is an exploration of the implications of specific modes on angular momentum. Some participants question the setup of the problem and the correctness of the expressions used, particularly regarding typographical errors and the interpretation of conditions in part (c).

Discussion Status

The discussion includes attempts to clarify typographical errors and the implications of the problem statement. Some participants express uncertainty about the conditions for the oscillatory modes and seek further clarification on specific points raised by others. There is an ongoing exploration of the mathematical expressions involved without reaching a consensus on the interpretations.

Contextual Notes

Participants note potential errors in the equations and the need for clarification on the problem statement, particularly regarding the total angular momentum and the conditions for the oscillatory modes. There is a mention of the need for a complete solution space due to repeated eigenvalues in the matrix involved.

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Homework Statement



a) Write down the Lagrangian and show that the equations of motion are:

m\ddot{θ_1}+k[2θ_1-θ_2-θ_3] = 0

m\ddot{θ_2}+k[2θ_2-θ_1-θ_3] = 0

m\ddot{θ_3}+k[2θ_3-θ_1-θ_2] = 0

b) Show that the mode in which θ_1 = θ_2 = θ_3 corresponds to constant total angular momentum \vec{L}.

c) Assume that the total angular momentum is zero and that θ_1 = θ_2 = θ_3 = 0. Find two degenerate oscillatory modes and their frequency. Hint: you might want to express the three coupled equations as a single equation for the vector \vec{θ}, then assume that the eigenvectors of the tensor appearing in this equation have a time dependence e^{iωt} and find the values of ω for each eigenvector.

Homework Equations



eq(1)\frac{∂L}{∂q_j}-\frac{d}{dt}\frac{∂L}{∂\dot{q_j}}=0

The Attempt at a Solution



Part A

Step 1) The Lagrangian:

T = \frac{mR^2}{2}[\dot{θ_1}^2+\dot{θ_2}^2+\dot{θ_3}^2]

U = \frac{kR^2}{2}[θ_1^2+θ_2^2+θ_3^2-θ_1θ_2-θ_1θ_3-θ_2θ_3]

L = T-U = \frac{mR^2}{2}[\dot{θ_1}^2+\dot{θ_2}^2+\dot{θ_3}^2] - \frac{kR^2}{2}[θ_1^2+θ_2^2+θ_3^2-θ_1θ_2-θ_1θ_3-θ_2θ_3]

\frac{∂L}{∂θ_1} = -kR^2[2θ_1-θ_2-θ_3]

\frac{d}{dt}\frac{∂L}{∂\dot{θ_1}} = \frac{d}{dt}[mR^2\dot{θ_1}] = mR^2\ddot{θ_1}

-kR^2[2θ_1-θ_2-θ_3]-mR^2\ddot{θ_1}=0

eq(2) m\ddot{θ_1}+k[2θ_1-θ_2-θ_3]

Similarly for θ_2 and θ_3

eq(3) m\ddot{θ_2}+k[2θ_2-θ_1-θ_3]

eq(4) m\ddot{θ_3}+k[2θ_3-θ_1-θ_2]

Part B

Combining eqs(2,3,and 4) into a vector equation:

\ddot{\vec{θ}}+ω_0^2\begin{pmatrix} 2&-1&-1\\-1&2&-1\\-1&-1&2\end{pmatrix}\vec{θ}=\vec{0}

Let the above matrix be called \mathbf A

Now when θ_1= θ_2= θ_3 the matrix vector product \mathbf A\vec{θ}=\vec{0}

This in turn yields \ddot{\vec{θ}} = \vec{0} →\dot{\vec{θ}}=\vec{C} where \vec{C} is a constant vector.

Part C

First I'll need the eigenvalues and the resulting eigenvectors of \mathbf A which without too much trouble are:

λ_1=0 and a degenerate eigenvalue λ_2 = λ_3 = 3

Which corresponds to the eigenvectors which have the time dependence e^{iωt}:

\vec{e_1} = (1,1,1)e^{iωt}, \vec{e_2} = (-1,0,1)e^{iωt}, and \vec{e_3} = (-1,1,0)e^{iωt}

When \mathbf A acts on \vec{θ} it produces two equations:

eq(5) \ddot{\vec{θ}}+(0)ω_0^2\vec{θ}=0

eq(6) \ddot{\vec{θ}}+(3)ω_0^2\vec{θ}=0

When I plug in eigenvectors 2 and 3 into eq(6) I get that ω^2 = 3ω_0^2.

Physically, I think this scenario would correspond to one particle being held still while the other two oscillate back and forth with the same angular speed but in the opposite angular direction. Its been forever since I have dealt with systems of DE's and I seem to remember needing to construct another vector when a matrix had a repeated eigenvalue (like this one does) in order to form a complete solution space for the system. Also the scenario I give satifies that total angular momentum is zero, but it doesn't satisfy the second condition that θ_1=θ_2=θ_3=0 which is what really kind of has me worried. Thank you for any help in advance!(:
 
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Diagram of the problem

Almost forgot to attach this(:
 

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There are some typographical errors in some of your subscripts in your first three equations of Part A of your solution. Also, I think the factor in front of the brackets for ##\small U## is off by a factor of 1/2.

But, overall, your work looks good to me.

I think the problem statement probably meant to say ##\theta_1+\theta_2+\theta_3 = 0## in part (c) of the question.
 
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TSny said:
There are some typographical errors in some of your subscripts in your first three equations of Part A of your solution. Also, I think the factor in front of the brackets for ##\small U## is off by a factor of 1/2.

But, overall, your work looks good to me.

I think the problem statement probably meant to say ##\theta_1+\theta_2+\theta_3 = 0## in part (c) of the question.

My expression for U is off by \frac{1}{2}? Could you go into a little more detail on that part please?

I was thinking that's what it meant on part c) as well but I wasn't sure. Thank you for clearing that part up for me(:

Could you please also point out exactly where the errors are? Because I can't see them. Thank you again for your help (:
 
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Wavefunction said:
My expression for U is off by \frac{1}{2}? Could you go into a little more detail on that part please?

I was thinking that's what it meant on part c) as well but I wasn't sure. Thank you for clearing that part up for me(:

Could you please also point out exactly where the errors are? Because I can't see them. Thank you again for your help (:

Nevermind I found the typographical error! Thank you again for pointing that out(:
 

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