Understanding Spacetime Diagrams | Basics Explained

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around spacetime diagrams, particularly in the context of relativity. Participants seek clarification on how to construct these diagrams, the significance of light's worldline, and the implications of the Lorentz transformation. The conversation includes both theoretical and practical aspects of creating and interpreting spacetime diagrams.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that light's worldline is at 45 degrees and seeks guidance on determining the angles of moving frames, suggesting a relationship to v/c.
  • Another participant proposes using inverse Lorentz transformations to confirm the straightness of axes in spacetime diagrams.
  • A different participant speculates that varying v may trace out a hyperbola in the x,t coordinates, based on the algebra of the Lorentz factor.
  • One response confirms the speculation about hyperbolas and emphasizes the utility of Minkowski diagrams for visualizing Lorentz boosts.
  • Another participant suggests that hyperbolas are not necessary and introduces the concept of causal diamonds, which are parallelograms with edges parallel to the light cone, to represent spacetime diagrams.
  • Several links to interactive visualizations and tools for creating spacetime diagrams are shared, indicating various approaches to understanding the topic.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various methods and interpretations regarding spacetime diagrams, with no clear consensus on a single approach or understanding. Multiple competing views remain on how to best represent and understand these diagrams.

Contextual Notes

Some participants mention specific mathematical relationships and transformations without resolving the implications or limitations of these methods. The discussion includes assumptions about the relationships between different variables and the nature of spacetime diagrams.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to individuals studying relativity, those looking to understand the construction and interpretation of spacetime diagrams, and anyone interested in the mathematical underpinnings of these concepts.

Grasshopper
Gold Member
Messages
210
Reaction score
115
Spacetime diagrams seem to be the most used explanation for relativity weirdness, so I’d like some clarification in how to make them, it anyone wants to help.

(1) Light’s worldline is 45 degrees, obviously. No issues there, I don’t think.

(2) How do I determine the angles of the moving frame? I would imagine it is related to v/c. Maybe c/v.

(3) How do I determine the size of the tick marks on the moving frame? This, I assume, must be related to the Lorentz factor.

I’m sure there are brainless ways to do it. And I could probably find it through google. But I trust this community more than a random internet search.

Thanks to all replies.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Write down a point an event on the ##t'## axis and inverse Lorentz transform it to get its ##x,t## coordinates. Ditto the ##x'## axis. Repeat for a few points events (or just write it generally in the first place) to confirm the axes are straight lines.

Useful thing to consider: as you vary ##v## what path does ##x,t## trace out?
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Grasshopper
Ibix said:
Write down a point on the ##t'## axis and inverse Lorentz transform it to get its ##x,t## coordinates. Ditto the ##x'## axis. Repeat for a few points (or just write it generally in the first place) to confirm the axes are straight lines.

Useful thing to consider: as you vary ##v## what path does ##x,t## trace out?
My guess is that it’s a hyperbola, although this is based only on the algebra of the Lorentz factor. I will have to test this when I get my calculator though.

But you’re answer actually seems kind of obvious in hindsight. Lorentz transforming would clearly give the correct values.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71 and Ibix
Your guess is correct.

Minkowski diagrams are, indeed, incredibly simple. Once you get that "events move along a hyperbola when boosted" thing into your head, and remember which direction they move when boosted by ##\pm v##, they're a very good way of visualising how a Lorentz boost is going to come out before you do the maths.

If you've got a device with a mouse rather than a touchscreen, my old animated Minkowski diagram tool (ibises.org.uk/Minkowski.html) let's you sketch scenarios and then animate boosts. If you only have a touchscreen the UI doesn't work so well, but you can still see canned diagrams (click buttons near the bottom of the page) and boost them. There's a diagram of hyperbolae, which you can watch being invariant (analogous to concentric circles under rotation in Euclidean geometry).
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71 and Grasshopper
It turns out that you don't need to explicitly draw a hyperbola.
Instead, with one corner fixed at the center of the hyperbola, draw equal-area "[causal] diamonds", which are parallelograms with edges parallel to the light cone.

The timelike diagonal is along the worldline with a chosen velocity.
The spacelike diagonal is along the line of simultaneity for that worldline.
The stretching and shrinking factor of the reshaped diamond is the Doppler factor, k.
The diamonds are the spacetime-diagrams of light clocks.

Visit my PF Insights:
https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/spacetime-diagrams-light-clocks/
https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/relativity-rotated-graph-paper/

This links to an early draft of my paper and a link to the published version:
https://arxiv.org/abs/1111.7254

Interactive visualizations are useful to get an intuition.
Here are some I made:
For more emphasis on hyperbolas (and "circles"), here are some I did in Desmos (where you can more easily see the underlying equations):
Use the E-slider to the geometric analogies from a circle (in Euclidean geometry), a Galilean-circle (in Galilean relativity), and a hyperbola (in Special Relativity)
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: vanhees71

Similar threads

Replies
8
Views
1K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 37 ·
2
Replies
37
Views
8K
  • · Replies 20 ·
Replies
20
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
4K
  • · Replies 9 ·
Replies
9
Views
353
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K