Understanding Convergence Factors in Physics Textbooks

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    Convergence Factors
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of convergence factors in physics textbooks, particularly in the context of quantum mechanics and propagators. Participants seek to understand the necessity, implications, and physical meaning of these factors, such as +0's or +i*nu, which are often added to integrals to ensure convergence.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses frustration over the lack of explanations regarding convergence factors in textbooks and seeks clarification on their necessity and implications.
  • Another participant suggests that the +i eps (or +i 0) is not added ad hoc but is necessary for obtaining a well-defined distribution and for ensuring a valid unitary representation of the Poincare group.
  • Concerns are raised about the straightforwardness of Fourier transforms of distributions and the need for special contour deformations in certain integrals.
  • A participant questions the physical justification for integrating around poles and whether this approach represents the "true" value of the integral.
  • One response provides an intuitive justification related to the coupling of small systems to the environment, suggesting that energy dissipation leads to a nonhermitian Hamiltonian.
  • A more rigorous justification is mentioned, referencing axiomatic properties of field theory and the Wightman axioms, which necessitate treating poles in a specific manner.
  • Discussion includes references to the Lippmann-Schwinger equation as a context for understanding the emergence of the i eps factor in nonrelativistic problems.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying levels of understanding and agreement regarding the necessity and implications of convergence factors. Some participants provide insights and justifications, while others remain uncertain about the physical motivations and mathematical justifications behind these factors. The discussion does not reach a consensus.

Contextual Notes

Participants highlight limitations in their understanding of distributions and integrals involving poles, indicating a need for background knowledge in these areas. The discussion reflects a range of mathematical rigor and conceptual clarity among participants.

maverick_starstrider
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"Convergence Factors"

In all my textbooks I always see these random convergence factors thrown in (+0's or +i*nu or some such) but I have never seen a book that would dirty itself by steeping so low as to explain what they are (I'm looking at you Wen, Bruus and Flensberg, Fetter and Walecka, etc.). I understand they are supposed to be some ad hoc infinitesimal added to guarantee some integral converges but can anyone point me to (or provide) an explanation of:

-when they are necessary
-why it is ok to add them on a whim
-what would happen is we didn't add them
-what is the physical meaning of adding them.


If you don't know what I'm talking about I'll give the example of the energy propogator

[itex]G_E(n_b,t_b,n_a,t_a) = -i \langle n_b \vert U(t,t_0) \vert n_a \rangle = -ie^{-i \epsilon_n (t_b - t_a) } \delta_{n_b,n_a}[/itex]

where when we move to frequency space we get

[itex]G_E(n_b,n_a,\omega) = \int_0^{\infty} dt G_E(n_b,t_a+t,n_a,t_a)e^{it\omega - 0^+ t} = \frac{1}{\omega - \epsilon_{n_a}+i 0^+} \delta_{n_b,n_a}[/itex]

I don't get the [itex]0^+[/itex].

Thanks in advance
 
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maverick_starstrider said:
In all my textbooks I always see these random convergence factors thrown in (+0's or +i*nu or some such) but I have never seen a book that would dirty itself by steeping so low as to explain what they are (I'm looking at you Wen, Bruus and Flensberg, Fetter and Walecka, etc.). I understand they are supposed to be some ad hoc infinitesimal added to guarantee some integral converges but can anyone point me to (or provide) an explanation of:

-when they are necessary
-why it is ok to add them on a whim
-what would happen is we didn't add them
-what is the physical meaning of adding them.


If you don't know what I'm talking about I'll give the example of the energy propogator

[itex]G_E(n_b,t_b,n_a,t_a) = -i \langle n_b \vert U(t,t_0) \vert n_a \rangle = -ie^{-i \epsilon_n (t_b - t_a) } \delta_{n_b,n_a}[/itex]

where when we move to frequency space we get

[itex]G_E(n_b,n_a,\omega) = \int_0^{\infty} dt G_E(n_b,t_a+t,n_a,t_a)e^{it\omega - 0^+ t} = \frac{1}{\omega - \epsilon_{n_a}+i 0^+} \delta_{n_b,n_a}[/itex]

I don't get the [itex]0^+[/itex].

Thanks in advance

The Fourier transform of distributions is not completely straightforward since the integrals don't make sense without the factors.

The +i eps (or +i 0) tells the way the integration contour must be deformed into the complex plane in order to get a well-defined distribution. See, e.g., http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Propagator_(Quantum_Theory)#Relativistic_propagators

They are not added in an ad hoc way but in order to get a free field theory with a valid unitary representation of the Poincare group satisfying causal (anti)commutation rules
(or, in condensed matter theory, the correct nonrelativistic propagator).
 


I appreciate the response but I'm afraid I'm not getting much from that. Why aren't the Fourier transforms of distributions straightforward (and which factors). What is a "well-defined" distribution? What is our goal here with this integral, why do these integrals needs special contour deformations that others don't?
 


maverick_starstrider said:
I appreciate the response but I'm afraid I'm not getting much from that. Why aren't the Fourier transforms of distributions straightforward (and which factors). What is a "well-defined" distribution? What is our goal here with this integral, why do these integrals needs special contour deformations that others don't?

What is your math background? It doesn't make sense to answer your questions before you get the relevant background knowledge.

Do you know what a distribution is?

Can you make sense of the integral without the +i eps? At some point the integrand becomes infinity - do you know how to define integrals in this case?
 


A. Neumaier said:
What is your math background? It doesn't make sense to answer your questions before you get the relevant background knowledge.

Do you know what a distribution is?

Can you make sense of the integral without the +i eps? At some point the integrand becomes infinity - do you know how to define integrals in this case?

I understand the math in the sense that you're essentially saying the integral is valued at its Cauchy Principal Value (am I wrong?). It's the physics and motivation of this. WHY is it physically correct to integrate around our pesky poles (or push them off the real line). Why should this be considered the "true" value of the integral. It's really not the same integral at all is it? Whenever physics throws a function (or distribution) which must be integrated across one of its poles why is it ok to just push the pole out of the way? This is what I don't understand.
 


maverick_starstrider said:
I understand the math in the sense that you're essentially saying the integral is valued at its Cauchy Principal Value (am I wrong?). It's the physics and motivation of this. WHY is it physically correct to integrate around our pesky poles (or push them off the real line). Why should this be considered the "true" value of the integral. It's really not the same integral at all is it? Whenever physics throws a function (or distribution) which must be integrated across one of its poles why is it ok to just push the pole out of the way? This is what I don't understand.

The usual intuitive justification is that the small systems considered in scattering experiments are not truly isolated but coupled to the environment, so that a tiny bit of energy dissipates. This makes the Hamiltonian slightly nonhermitian (adds an optical potential). But of course it os too small to be worth modeling it directly. so one treats the system as conservative and only adds the infinitesimal i eps.

A more rigorous justification is obtained if you start with axiomatic properties that must be reasonably assumed to hold for any decent field theory, based on relativity, causality, and stability. This leads to the Wightman axioms. Then one can show (see Weinberg) that the free fields satisfy the axioms only if the poles are treated in the textbook fashion.

On a more elementary level, one can see how the i eps arises rigorously for nonrelativistic problems in the solution of the Lippmann-Schwinger equation. For a fairly rigorous discussion, see Vol. 3 of Thirring's Course on Mathematical Physics.
 

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