Understanding the Derivative of ln^2: Integration by Parts

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the derivative in the context of an integration by parts problem involving the integral of ln^2(x^21). Participants are exploring the steps necessary to evaluate this integral through integration by parts, specifically focusing on how to derive du.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Problem interpretation

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are questioning the derivation of du and whether substitution is necessary for the problem. Some suggest alternative methods for integration by parts, while others express confusion over the steps involved.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the differentiation process and the application of integration by parts. There are varying opinions on the necessity of substitution, and some guidance has been offered regarding the structure of the integral and the roles of u and dv.

Contextual Notes

There is mention of an attachment that provides part of the solution, but the full integration process has not been completed by the participants. The original poster expresses frustration with the problem, indicating a need for clarification rather than a complete solution.

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Homework Statement


I'm trying to understand how they got du in this problem. It is an integration by parts question. Anyway, the question asks me to evaluation this integral by using integration by parts two times
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Homework Equations


Screen shot 2010-04-18 at 2.06.04 PM.png

This is how we would solve the problem...



The Attempt at a Solution


This is the first step.
Screen shot 2010-04-18 at 1.55.51 PM.png


The solution to the entire problem isn't what I need. I'll be able to get that after I figure out how they got du. I just need to see how you get du.

What it looks like they did was just go 2*(ln x^21)*(1/x)*(21x^2)
This isn't equal to the answer, though. Any ideas? No need to rush on this. The assignment is done, I just got monumentally frustrated with this one.

Thanks in advance to anyone that can help.
 
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you suppose to get

[tex]\frac{du}{dx}[/tex] = 42(ln x21)x20
 
Is the substitution really necessary, I mean, is it part of what you're being taught right now and must use it?

Because I find the following way to be more straightforward. Use integration by parts two times via this formula: [itex]\int f'(x)g(x)dx = f(x)g(x) - \int f(x)g'(x)dx[/itex]

by doing the following: [itex]\int ln^2(x^{21})dx=\int (x)'ln^2(x^{21})dx=xln^2(x^{21}) - \int x(ln^2(x^{21}))'dx...[/itex]
 
but that what we learn at school, the substitution is merely to make student more understand i guess. But ones you get it, you don't need those substitution.
 
annoymage said:
you suppose to get

[tex]\frac{du}{dx}[/tex] = 42(ln x21)x20
Wrong. Look at the attachment to the original post. The correct answer is right there.So, to help with the original post.
a1ccook said:
[Anyway, the question asks me to evaluation this integral by using integration by parts two times
Did you do that?

This is the first step.
They gave you part of the first step. In particular, the attachment tells you exactly what to use how to express that integral in the form of [itex]\int u dv[/itex] needed for application of the integration by parts. Then it tells you what [itex]du[/itex] and [itex]v[/itex] are given that assignment. It does not perform the actual integration by parts, that is up to you. Then, as suggested, you should integrate by parts again, obviously with a different choice for u and dv this second step.
 
owho, sorry, i missed to differentiate something, hoho, sorry sorry
 

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