Understanding the Relationship Between Photon Spin and Polarization Vectors

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between photon spin and polarization vectors, particularly focusing on the polarization states of photons and their classification as helicity eigenstates. Participants explore theoretical aspects, definitions, and implications of these concepts in the context of quantum field theory.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants reference a footnote in Griffiths' text regarding polarization vectors for photons and seek to understand their relation to angular momentum or helicity operators.
  • It is noted that the polarization vectors correspond to right and left circularly polarized waves.
  • Some participants argue that these polarization states are also helicity eigenstates, while others clarify that photons do not possess spin but are indeed eigenstates of helicity.
  • A participant questions how to demonstrate the relationship between polarization vectors and helicity, prompting discussions about the helicity operator for massless particles.
  • One participant explains that the helicity operator for massless particles is the Lorentz generator of the stability little group.
  • Another participant emphasizes that spin is defined in the rest frame of a particle, which is not applicable to photons, leading to a distinction between spin and helicity.
  • A later reply suggests that the distinction between spin and helicity is a semantic issue, indicating a potential disagreement on definitions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether polarization vectors can be classified as spin eigenstates, with some asserting that photons lack spin while others maintain that they are helicity eigenstates. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the definitions and implications of spin versus helicity.

Contextual Notes

There are limitations in the discussion regarding the definitions of spin and helicity, as well as the implications of massless versus massive particles. The relationship between polarization vectors and angular momentum is not fully resolved, and assumptions about the applicability of certain definitions are not explicitly stated.

PeroK
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TL;DR
Relationship between photon spin and polarisation.
In Griffiths Elementary Particles (2nd, revised edition) there is a footnote on page 241, which states that the photon states with ##m_s = \pm 1## are related to the polarization vector by:
$$\epsilon_+ = \frac 1 {\sqrt 2} (-1, -i, 0) \ \text{and} \ \epsilon_- = \frac 1 {\sqrt 2} (1, -i, 0)$$
But, he doesn't give any justification for this. How do we relate these spatial polarisation vectors to eigenstates of the relevant angular momentum or helicity operator?
 
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Those are polarization vectors for right and left circular polarized waves.
 
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Meir Achuz said:
Those are polarization vectors for right and left circular polarized waves.
Yes, I know. But aren't they also spin eigenstates?
 
They are helicity eigenstates. Massless fields are different wrt. spin-like degrees of freedom. For spin ##s## there are only 2 helicity-degrees of freedom rather than ##(2s+1)## for nassive particles. The reason is to be found in the analysis of the unitary reps. of the Poincare group. See Weinberg, QT of fields, vol. 1.
 
PeroK said:
Yes, I know. But aren't they also spin eigenstates?

No, because photons have no spin. But they are eigenstates of helicity.
 
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DrDu said:
No, because photons have no spin. But they are eigenstates of helicity.
How do we show that?

What is the helicity operator for photons?
 
PeroK said:
How do we show that?

What is the helicity operator for photons?
For any massless particle, the helicity operator is the Lorentz generator J_{12} of the stability little group* G_{p} of p^{\mu} = E (1,0,0,-1), with E>0.

* G_{p} = \big\{ \forall \Lambda \in SO(1,3) | \ \Lambda p = p \big\}
 
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samalkhaiat said:
For any massless particle, the helicity operator is the Lorentz generator J_{12} of the stability little group* G_{p} of p^{\mu} = E (1,0,0,-1), with E>0.

* G_{p} = \big\{ \forall \Lambda \in SO(1,3) | \ \Lambda p = p \big\}
That explains why I couldn't figure it out myself. Thanks.
 
PeroK said:
How do we show that?

What is the helicity operator for photons?
Spin is the angular momentum in the rest frame of a particle. As a photon cannot be brought to rest, we can't define its spin.
 
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"Spin is the angular momentum in the rest frame of a particle "
That is a property of spin for a massive particle, not a definition.
Helicity is the component of angular momentum in the direction of the momentum.
It's just a quibble over words.
 
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