Understanding velocity and acceleration

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concepts of velocity and acceleration, focusing on their definitions, relationships, and the conditions under which certain equations apply. Participants explore the implications of using average versus instantaneous speed and the validity of differentiation in the context of motion equations.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that speed is defined as distance divided by time, represented mathematically as v = s/t.
  • Others clarify that in the equation v = s/t, 'v' denotes average speed over a specific time interval, while in the equation accel = dv/dt, 'v' refers to instantaneous speed.
  • One participant points out that differentiation in the context of speed and time is only valid if distance (s) is constant and time (t) is variable.
  • Another participant challenges the previous claim by stating that when deriving velocity from acceleration, it is common to treat acceleration as constant, referencing a derivation from Wikipedia.
  • There is a reiteration that the differentiation mentioned is valid only under the assumption that distance (s) remains constant.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the treatment of variables in the equations for velocity and acceleration. There is no consensus on the validity of certain mathematical approaches or the implications of treating acceleration as constant.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations regarding assumptions about the constancy of variables and the conditions under which certain mathematical operations are valid. Specific mathematical steps and definitions are also points of contention.

coverband
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speed = distance/time
v=s/t
Acceleration = dv/dt = -s/t^2 ?
 
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In the equation v = s/t, 'v' represents average speed over the period from time 0 to time t.

In the equation accel = dv/dt, 'v' represents instantaneous speed at time t.

Unless acceleration is always zero, average speed and instantaneous speed are different items, and cannot be represented by the same variable letter ('v' in this case).
 
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Another thing to add is that the differentiation in post #1 would be valid only if ##s## were a constant and ##t## were a variable. Does that make sense?
 
DrGreg said:
Another thing to add is that the differentiation in post #1 would be valid only if ##s## were a constant and ##t## were a variable. Does that make sense?

No because when deriving an equation for v we start with a = dv/dt -> dv = a dt -> v=[int]a dt -> v = u + at. This is how Wikipedia derives the first equation of motion. They treat a as a constant. Thanks for your first answer though
 
coverband said:
No because when deriving an equation for v we start with a = dv/dt -> dv = a dt -> v=[int]a dt -> v = u + at. This is how Wikipedia derives the first equation of motion. They treat a as a constant. Thanks for your first answer though
I said constant ##s##, not constant ##a##. My comments refer specifically to $$
\frac{d}{dt} \left( \frac{s}{t} \right) = -\frac{s}{t^2},
$$which is valid only if ##s## is constant.
 

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