Using 5C2 to calculate number of ways to get 2 heads in 5 coin tosses

  • Thread starter Thread starter Darkmisc
  • Start date Start date
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the application of the binomial coefficient 5C2 in the context of calculating the number of ways to achieve two heads in five coin tosses. Participants explore the meaning of the numbers involved in the formula and how they relate to the scenario of coin flips.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the interpretation of the numbers in the binomial coefficient, with one questioning how to visualize the scenario of coin flips. Others suggest different ways to explain the reasoning behind the formula, including permutations and combinations.

Discussion Status

Some participants express clarity in their understanding of the formula, while others continue to seek a deeper explanation of the components involved. There is an exploration of different perspectives on how to represent the problem mathematically, indicating a productive exchange of ideas.

Contextual Notes

There is an emphasis on avoiding double counting in the arrangements of heads and tails, with participants considering various methods of representation, including factorial notation and direct counting approaches.

Darkmisc
Messages
222
Reaction score
31
Homework Statement
How many ways can you get two heads in five coin tosses
Relevant Equations
5C2 = 10
Hi everyone

I'm looking at binomial distributions and one of the examples uses 5C2 to calculate the number of ways you can get two heads from five coin tosses. I don't question that the formula is correct, I just find it hard to picture what the numbers represent.

The numbers make sense to me in the context of 5 choose 2. For example, if you are choosing a team of two from five people, 5 represents the number of choices for the first spot. Four represents the number of choices for the second spot. You then divide the permutations by two to avoid double counting.

What do the numbers mean in the case of five coin flips? I'm picturing it more as a case of 2 choose 5 (even though that's probably not a thing). You can choose between heads or tails and have five flips to fill.

If I were to represent the coin flip situation as 5x4/2, what would the 5, 4 and 2 mean?Thanks
 
Physics news on Phys.org
HHTTT
HTHTT
HTTHT
HTTTH
THHTT
THTHT
THTTH
TTHHT
TTHTH
TTTHH
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Darkmisc
Actually, I think I get it now. Would this be a good way to explain it?

If you look at the permutations, a head can occur on any of the five flips. Once you know a head has occurred at a given flip, there are only four other possible places for the second head to occur. The permutations need to be divided by two to avoid double counting. Thus, 5x4/2.
 
Darkmisc said:
Actually, I think I get it now. Would this be a good way to explain it?

If you look at the permutations, a head can occur on any of the five flips. Once you know a head has occurred at a given flip, there are only four other possible places for the second head to occur. The permutations need to be divided by two to avoid double counting. Thus, 5x4/2.
That's the idea. You could code those ten combinations (note these are not permutations) by specifying the two places where the heads are. So, HHTTT becomes 12; and TTHTH becomes 35 etc.

And now this is equivalent to drawing two numbers from a pot of five numbers (without replacement) and where the order you draw the numbers does not matter. I.e. drawing number 1 then number 2 is the same as drawing number 2 then number 1. And that is more explicity ##\frac{5 \times 4}{2}##.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Darkmisc
Darkmisc said:
If I were to represent the coin flip situation as 5x4/2, what would the 5, 4 and 2 mean?
I would not try to understand it that way. I would understand it in the form 5!/(2!3!),
The 5! is the number of ways to order 5 objects if they are all different.
The 2! is the number of ways that the two heads have been over-counted. Swapping the two heads should not be counted twice, so divide by 2!.
The 3! is the number of ways that the three tails have been over-counted. Swapping any of them should not be counted again, so divide by 3!.
 
  • Like
Likes   Reactions: Darkmisc

Similar threads

Replies
2
Views
2K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
1K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
12
Views
4K
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
2K
Replies
15
Views
2K
Replies
7
Views
4K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
4K