Vegetarian or Not? Poll & Forum Discussion

[lisab]

I went hunting once. Shot the deer in the leg. Had to kill it with a shovel. Took about an hour.

I'm guessing that will be your last hunting experience.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I went hunting once. Shot the deer in the leg. Had to kill it with a shovel. Took about an hour.

It was the only humane thing to do. I hope you didn't damage the head area. That would ruin the trophy.

 

[VeeEight]

I'm guessing that will be your last hunting experience.

It's safe to say I won't be there next season

 

[Loren Booda]

I have been trying out a mostly vegetarian diet for the past few weeks. I don't particularly miss meat. I actually have gained five pounds.

My grocery bill has gone down somewhat. Options at my regular grocer have diminished, however.

Veggie dishes in the summer mostly cool one off compared to meat dishes. I must try vegetable/fruit stands.

__________Some jerk shot a deer in the flank with an arrow at my suburban park years ago. There was nothing we could do except watch it run, or preferably, shoot apples from the head of the fool.

 

[Danger]

I went hunting once. Shot the deer in the leg. Had to kill it with a shovel. Took about an hour.

You don't seem to be a cruel person, so I can only assume that you're a lousy shot. Even so, it only makes sense that one will always carry enough spare ammo to administer a close-up kill shot in a situation such as yours. Or, at the very least, a large knife for introduction to the carotid.
I'm not a hunter, despite my love of weapons, but I have no argument with those who do it legitimately. Trophy hunters and thrill-killers grit my gears immensely, though. I reside in prime hunting country, and every person that I know who does it at least eats the animal. Food might not be the primary reason for the endeavour (male bonding, communing with nature, passing skills on to an offspring, etc. are instigating factors as well), but the meat isn't wasted. Killing something for food is okay, and it doesn't really make a lot of difference as to where that occurs. A meat-packing plant, forest hunting area, or tuna-canning ship all present the same net effect to the food. I just happen to have a preference for it being a "humane" kill. Even when I used to hunt gophers years ago, I always used over-loaded ammo and took the head shot so they wouldn't feel it. Nothing dismays a legit hunter more than seeing an animal wounded rather than instantly killed.
I know that I would be haunted forever over something like what happened to you (as I am by a couple of things of a minor but similar nature). Perhaps knowing that you did what you deemed necessary to alleviate the situation, no matter how distasteful, will offer you some comfort.

 

[VeeEight]

You don't seem to be a cruel person

I am sometimes cruel. I can also be a downright thief and liar.

 

[Danger]

I am sometimes cruel. I can also be a downright thief and liar.

Same here, but taking it out on a human, who should know better, is not the same as torturing an animal. Remember that you are dealing with an ex-professional writer here, and several other people who are a lot brighter than me. No matter how much you deny it, I can tell by the phraseology, punctuation and spacing of your post that you feel bad about it. Just remember that sometimes it's good to feel bad. It makes you think twice before repeating the mistake.

 

[VeeEight]

I can tell by the phraseology, punctuation and spacing of your post that you feel bad about it.

Am I that transparent?! No wonder I suck at poker.

 

[Danger]

Am I that transparent?! No wonder I suck at poker.

 

[Jamma]

I was brought up a vegetarian, and had remained one my whole life (I am 22), up to about a year ago, when I started eating fish.

I was not the annoying sort of vegetarian who would demand that I couldn't eat from a plate which had had meat on it etc. (I do know people like that). The reason I started eating fish is that I started realising that it wasn't the actual killing of the animal that I disliked, my main issues were with the environmental aspects (although I also dislike the cruelty). Fish are already in the sea, unlike the millions of cows etc. which do more damage to the environment than cars do.

People say that this is dumb, because fish stocks are low and I am actually causing more damage to the environment, but for me it's just like any other product in the world that is in low supply, when fish stocks get so low that it is too expensive, I will just turn to vegetarianism again.

I wonder if it will ever be possible to grow giant cubes of mindless meat, without the same amount of pollution? This I would be in favour with!

 

[Danger]

I wonder if it will ever be possible to grow giant cubes of mindless meat, without the same amount of pollution? This I would be in favour with!

That would be super-cool, and could solve a couple of different issues at the same time. If you manage to genetically engineer a Black Angus/cactus hybrid, you could grow steaks out in the desert which is otherwise wasted space. Me likes.

 

[Evo]

That would be super-cool, and could solve a couple of different issues at the same time. If you manage to genetically engineer a Black Angus/cactus hybrid, you could grow steaks out in the desert which is otherwise wasted space. Me likes.

I saw this in a tv documentary. Here's a news report about it.

Scientists grow pork meat in a laboratory

SCIENTISTS have grown meat in the laboratory for the first time. Experts in Holland used cells from a live pig to replicate growth in a petri dish.

The advent of so-called “in-vitro” or cultured meat could reduce the billions of tons of greenhouse gases emitted each year by farm animals — if people are willing to eat it.

So far the scientists have not tasted it, but they believe the breakthrough could lead to sausages and other processed products being made from laboratory meat in as little as five years’ time.

They initially extracted cells from the muscle of a live pig. Called myoblasts, these cells are programmed to grow into muscle and repair damage in animals.

The cells were then incubated in a solution containing nutrients to encourage them to multiply indefinitely. This nutritious “broth” is derived from the blood products of animal foetuses, although the intention is to come up with a synthetic solution.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article6936352.ece

More here. http://www.physorg.com/news178869104.html

 

[DanP]

Meat ~250-300g / day. Turkey / chicken breast preferred. Milk, 1.5% fat 1-2 L / day. Eggs when I feel so. I fill the rest with vegetables soups, spinach, broccoli ,carrots, oatmeal, black bread and whatever else. Kefir / yogurt / cheese sometimes bu then I cut the milk.

I eat pasta too sometimes. Ill never give it up :P Italian recipes are too cool. Carbonara is my favorite. I love chocolate. French deserts. I indulge in them seldom.

I like to eat. In this period , I prolly average a figure close to 3500 kcal / day. It would be a nightmare to try to get them from a vegetarian diet.

I use various supplements too. I like my urine to be expensive :P

 

[VeeEight]

I like my urine to be expensive :P

Maybe you should change your name to RichP

 

[DanP]

Maybe you should change your name to RichP

Cmmon, Some Omega 3, a multivitamin, Mg, and whey protein for the times I don't get enough from food ... I keep it low :P

 

[Jamma]

I saw this in a tv documentary. Here's a news report about it.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/article6936352.ece

More here. http://www.physorg.com/news178869104.html

Thanks for this, very cool.

I'm not trying to be preachy here, I'm not like that, but I just randomly read this in a book I have, "The Oxbridge Questions- Do You Think You're Clever?", and I find it pretty staggering:

"It takes on average nearly 5,000 litres of water to produce just one quarter-pound beef burger - 1,000 times as much as for the same weight of wheat. So if you were to eat just two burgers a week for a year, it would take half a million litres of water."

 

[Evo]

Thanks for this, very cool.

I'm not trying to be preachy here, I'm not like that, but I just randomly read this in a book I have, "The Oxbridge Questions- Do You Think You're Clever?", and I find it pretty staggering:

"It takes on average nearly 5,000 litres of water to produce just one quarter-pound beef burger - 1,000 times as much as for the same weight of wheat. So if you were to eat just two burgers a week for a year, it would take half a million litres of water."

Are you talking about live cattle? You realize that they urinate and respirate and give most of that water back, right?

 

[wolram]

I'm not sure it is meat we get in England, ever since the local butcher shops closed down we buy this pink stuff from supermarkets, it is tasteless and needs tenderising with a big hammer before it is edible.

 

[Monique]

Are you talking about live cattle? You realize that they urinate and respirate and give most of that water back, right?

He's talking about drinking water, which is a limited commodity in certain regions. I read a story in the paper the other day about Coca Cola planting a factory on some Indian farmland, they took so much ground water from the region that none was left for the farmers and the people living there. The whole region is nothing but wasteland now. To top it off, the waste water that the factor dumped was contaminated with heavy metals.

 

[sshzp4]

Gave up meat+fish for some weird reason when I was like 3. I simply refused. Obstinacy prevailed over parental tactics. Probably had something to do with all the animal/fable based cartoons+Discovery. Now I don't eat meat cause I have no taste for it.

I used to want to be a zoologist. :/

Anyone else here a fan of Ramen+Pizza? :)

 

[Proton Soup]

i'm an omnivore. and i think veganism is pretty stupid. at the very least, everyone should eat some fish/seafood and dairy products. a great deal of the benefits from vegetarian-type diets come from the potassium in fruits and veggies. but without animal products, you're going to come up deficient in essential w-3 fatty acids (no, ALA is not sufficient), B12, and likely some minerals.

 

[rolerbe]

I'm a level 5 vegan, I don't eat anything that casts a shadow.

 

[rolerbe]

NB: never eat a vegan 'dessert' (trust me on this).

 

[DanP]

Anyone else here a fan of Ramen+Pizza? :)

Are there vegetarian pizza's ? Most pizza's I ate where oozing fats of animal origins.

 

[Danger]

Are there vegetarian pizza's ? Most pizza's I ate where oozing fats of animal origins.

Vegetarian, yes; vegan, no. In order to be acceptable to a vegan, it would no longer be a pizza regardless of what one advertises it as.

 

[Evo]

He's talking about drinking water, which is a limited commodity in certain regions. I read a story in the paper the other day about Coca Cola planting a factory on some Indian farmland, they took so much ground water from the region that none was left for the farmers and the people living there. The whole region is nothing but wasteland now. To top it off, the waste water that the factor dumped was contaminated with heavy metals.

I know there are areas not fit for raising cattle. However, cattle are often raised on land that is not suitable for growing crops.

My question to the poster is what his specific post was about.

 

[Loren Booda]

My girlfriend tells me that Paul McCartney won't eat anything with a face.

 

[Proton Soup]

I know there are areas not fit for raising cattle. However, cattle are often raised on land that is not suitable for growing crops.

My question to the poster is what his specific post was about.

i think it's coming from stuff like this: http://www.ajcn.org/cgi/content/full/78/3/657S

 

[Danger]

My girlfriend tells me that Paul McCartney won't eat anything with a face.

That's a pretty arbitrary classification. Does a squid have a face? Sure, it has eyes and a mouth and something that intakes water for respiration... but I can't imagine it being chosen as "Miss Mollusk of the Month" for Playboy.

 

[Jamma]

I know there are areas not fit for raising cattle. However, cattle are often raised on land that is not suitable for growing crops.

My question to the poster is what his specific post was about.

The quote I used was as I read it, with no preceding information. However, I believe that it is talking about the amount of freshwater required to be physically given to the cow to give you the meat. The fact that it respires it etc. is irrelevant, the point is about how much water it takes to bring up a cow which could be used elsewhere, obviously the water will be returned to the environment eventually.

I'm not sure on this, but as I said, I wasn't trying to make a point as such, I was just amazed at the statistic.