What exactly is moment, and when is it zero?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of moment in the context of statics and dynamics, specifically addressing the conditions under which a moment is zero and the implications for rotation at pinned joints. Participants explore definitions, examples, and the relationship between moment and rotation.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that moment is what causes rotation, but expresses confusion about how pins, which allow rotation, can have zero moment.
  • Another participant proposes that a pinned joint has zero moment resistance, meaning no moment can be transferred, but this does not prevent rotation about the joint.
  • A participant mentions that a free body can rotate without an acting moment, indicating that an initial moment may have caused the rotation, but none is needed to maintain it.
  • There is a discussion about whether the sum of moments about a pin can be nonzero, with one participant questioning this possibility.
  • Another participant clarifies that a pin cannot exert a moment on a body, even if other moments are acting on the body, which could cause angular acceleration.
  • A later reply confirms that while the moment at a pin can be nonzero, the pin itself cannot apply any moment to the body.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of moment at pinned joints and whether it can be nonzero. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these definitions and the conditions under which moments act.

Contextual Notes

There are unresolved assumptions regarding the definitions of moment and moment resistance, as well as the conditions under which rotation occurs at pinned joints.

x86
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I've been dealing with the concept of moment this whole year, in statics/dynamics but I've never really completely understood it, just rather memorized it.

What I think moment is:
If some point on a body has moment, then this means it wants to rotate. So moment is essentially what causes rotation.

But here is something that I'm confused about:
Pins allow rotation, so they have zero moment.

That is what confuses me. I understand that pins don't resist moment, so there is no unknown moment about a pin. But according to my above definition of moment, if the moment at the point of the pin is zero then this means it will not rotate? But pins are supposed to allow rotation?
 
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Probably a better definition of a pinned joint is that it has zero moment resistance. So no moment can be transferred to the supports or other connecting bodies. But that doesn't mean it can't rotate about the joint or about any other point for that matter.

Consider a free body rotating in space. There is no "moment" acting on it but it still rotates at the same speed. Some kind of moment caused this initial rotation but no moment is necessary for it to continue to rotate. So I would amend your definition to say that a moment can cause rotation.
 
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paisiello2 said:
Probably a better definition of a pinned joint is that it has zero moment resistance. So no moment can be transferred to the supports or other connecting bodies. But that doesn't mean it can't rotate about the joint or about any other point for that matter.

Consider a free body rotating in space. There is no "moment" acting on it but it still rotates at the same speed. Some kind of moment caused this initial rotation but no moment is necessary for it to continue to rotate. So I would amend your definition to say that a moment can cause rotation.

I am still slightly confused.

is it possible for the sum of moments about a pin to not be zero?
 
A frictionless surface is not capable of exerting a tangential force on a body in contact with the surface, even though there may be tangential forces from other sources acting on the body (causing it to accelerate). A pin is not capable to exerting a moment on a body attached to the pin, even though there may be moments acting on the body from other sources (causing it to experience angular acceleration).

Chet
 
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Chestermiller said:
A frictionless surface is not capable of exerting a tangential force on a body in contact with the surface, even though there may be tangential forces from other sources acting on the body (causing it to accelerate). A pin is not capable to exerting a moment on a body attached to the pin, even though there may be moments acting on the body from other sources (causing it to experience angular acceleration).

Chet

Ah okay. Thanks. Then it is possible for the moment at a pin to be nonzero. (However, the pin can't apply any moment to the body).
 
x86 said:
Ah okay. Thanks. Then it is possible for the moment at a pin to be nonzero. (However, the pin can't apply any moment to the body).
Yes. Exactly,
 
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