What happens to water droplets and ice cubes at zero pressure?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion explores the behavior of water droplets and ice cubes at zero pressure, considering the implications of phase diagrams and temperature conditions, particularly near absolute zero. Participants examine the effects of low pressure on the states of water and the processes involved, such as sublimation and vaporization.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants suggest that the phase diagram of water is essential to understanding the behavior of water and ice at zero pressure.
  • There is a discussion about the role of vapor pressure and whether it must be considered in the context of zero pressure conditions.
  • One participant notes that starting with zero pressure in a closed volume may lead to an increase in pressure due to evaporation, challenging the notion of maintaining zero pressure throughout the experiment.
  • Another participant proposes a scenario involving ice cubes in space, questioning whether they would vaporize completely due to sublimation, despite intermolecular forces holding the solid together.
  • It is mentioned that at low pressure, water droplets may not exist, and only solid ice and vapor could be present, similar to the behavior of frozen CO2 at atmospheric pressure.
  • Some participants argue that while liquid water at zero pressure is not in equilibrium, it is possible to observe the system as it transitions towards equilibrium.
  • There is a reiteration that the forces holding the solid together are temperature-dependent and that dynamic equilibrium plays a role in the processes of evaporation and condensation.
  • One participant inquires about the availability of an accurate phase diagram for water.
  • A scenario is presented where boiling occurs in a vacuum, illustrating that water can boil even without a space walk, as demonstrated with a syringe experiment.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the behavior of water and ice at zero pressure, with no consensus reached on the implications of phase diagrams or the conditions under which water may exist in different states.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes assumptions about the initial conditions of pressure and temperature, and the implications of dynamic equilibrium are noted but not resolved.

quantum123
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What happens to water droplets and ice cubes at zero pressure?
Does it depends on the phase diagrams of water?
What if at the same time, the temperature is absolute zero or very close to it?
 
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Phase diagram is all you need.
 
So what is the answer?
Do we need to invoke the concept of vapor pressure?
 
Vapor pressure plays a crucial role.

It occurred to me that question is not precise. Initially I assumed by 'zero pressure' you mean zero pressure from the beginning of the experiment to the end of the experiment. But if it is that we just start with zero pressure and we proceed in some closed volume, whatever evaporates will increase the pressure - so it won't be zero.
 
How about throwing some ice cubes and spraying your garden hose out of the space shuttle?
 
That's close to assumption that volume is infinite, so the pressure is constant - and for all practical purposes equals zero.

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methods
 
At a low enough presure, you don't have water droplets, only solid (ice) and vapor (steam), similar to frozen CO2 at atmospheric pressure. The evaporative process of solid to gas is called sublimation.
 
Depends. There is nothing wrong with situation when you have a zero pressure and liquid water - it won't last long, as it is not an equilibrium, but it is not impossible.

And the question - as posted - asked "what happens", so my understanding is that we not necesarilly start at equilibrium, but we observe system as it goes to equilibrium.
 
So if we let ice cubes float around in space-walks and there will be sublimation - in other words, they will all vaporize? But I thought there are attractive intermolecular forces to hold the solid together?
 
  • #10
It is all in the phase diagram. Forces that you mentioned are temperature dependent and what we see is effect of dynamic equilibrium. Molecules on the surface always evaporate (sublimate), molecules close to the surface always condense. Depending on the pressure and tepmerature speed of these processes change and either evaporation or condensation dominates, moving mass from solid or liquid to gas phase or back.
 
  • #11
Do you have a link to a the water phase diagram? (an accurate one)
 
  • #12
quantum123 said:
So if we let ice cubes float around in space-walks and there will be sublimation - in other words, they will all vaporize? But I thought there are attractive intermolecular forces to hold the solid together?

The solid is a low-energy configuration compared to the gas, but remember that atoms can have a distribution of energies as they jiggle randomly against each other. All it takes is for an atom on the surface to gain enough energy to detach, and it's gone, into the vacuum, never to return. In the end (equilibrium), all the atoms are in the gas phase.
 
  • #13
Will water boil in space?
If I hold a beaker of water during a space-walk, will I see bubbles coming out?
 
  • #14
Yes.

You don't need a space walk for that. Take a syringe, fill it with hot water (hot tap water should do). Block the exit and pull the piston so that there is a vacuum created over the water. You will see water boiling for a few seconds, till it reaches equibrium between temperature of water and pressure above.

Similar effect can be seen during vacuum filitration.

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