Why does q-axis stator current control torque in 3-ph IM?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the relationship between stator current components and torque control in three-phase induction motors (IM). Participants explore the theoretical underpinnings of how the q-axis current influences torque generation, particularly in the context of vector control strategies.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants explain that decoupling the three-phase currents results in id and iq currents, which control flux and torque, respectively, but question the origin of this relationship.
  • One participant proposes that the stator current induces a magnetic field with a specific angle to the rotor field, leading to the decomposition of the stator current into Id and Iq components, where Id does not contribute to torque while Iq does.
  • Another participant reiterates the same point about the decomposition of stator current and its implications for torque generation, emphasizing the efficiency of controlling Id to be zero in vector-controlled systems.
  • A later reply suggests visualizing a simplified machine model to understand the concepts better, referencing a previous discussion on armature reaction and its connection to torque.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express similar views regarding the decomposition of stator current and its effects on torque, but there is no consensus on the foundational aspects of the relationship or the implications for control strategies.

Contextual Notes

Some assumptions about the magnetic field interactions and the specific conditions under which the torque control is effective remain unaddressed. The discussion does not resolve the mathematical or theoretical details of the decomposition process.

Ziya
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I know that decoupling the 3 phase currents we get the id and iq (in rotor frame) currents which control the flux and torque respectively. But where does the relation come from?
 
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I think ( don't know for sure ) that if we have an instant stator current, Istat, that induces a B-field ( Bstat ) which has an angle α to Brotor,
then the Istat is decomposed into Id = Istat * cos α , Iq = Istat * sin α.

In this way Id will not yield any torque, because BId has an angle to Brotor = 0.

BIq has angle to Brotor = 90°, so Iq will yield a torque.

That's why a vector-controlled system tries to control Id to be zero, thus increasing the efficiency of the motor.

Controlling a synchronous motor, you don't need these Id's and Iq's: You just measure the angular position of the rotor by means of an encoder, then induce a current in the stator that will create a Bstat, that is perpendicular to the Brotor.
 
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Hesch said:
I think ( don't know for sure ) that if we have an instant stator current, Istat, that induces a B-field ( Bstat ) which has an angle α to Brotor,
then the Istat is decomposed into Id = Istat * cos α , Iq = Istat * sin α.

In this way Id will not yield any torque, because BId has an angle to Brotor = 0.

BIq has angle to Brotor = 90°, so Iq will yield a torque.

That's why a vector-controlled system tries to control Id to be zero, thus increasing the efficiency of the motor.

Controlling a synchronous motor, you don't need these Id's and Iq's: You just measure the angular position of the rotor by means of an encoder, then induce a current in the stator that will create a Bstat, that is perpendicular to the Brotor.
Thank you. I got it now.
I am one year too late :smile:
 
It may help you to imagine a simplified machine with a one turn armature and permanent magnet field
from a thread last year

one_turn_machine-jpg.86991.jpg


that old thread addressed armature reaction
but it's a short hop from there to torque.
https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/armature-reaction-drop.826513/#post-5191404
 

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