Would it be possible to detect change in charge?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the possibility of detecting changes in the unitary charge of elementary particles, such as protons and electrons. Participants explore theoretical implications, potential experimental observations, and the relationship between charge and fundamental constants like the fine-structure constant.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the unitary charge is constant over time and if changes could be detected.
  • Another participant references the Fractional Quantum Hall Effect as evidence that changes in charge could be detected, suggesting that if the unit charge changes, it can be observed.
  • It is proposed that changes in the force between charged objects could be measurable, depending on the nature of the charge changes.
  • A participant mentions that if the fine-structure constant changes, it could indicate a change in charge, but distinguishing the cause of such a change (whether due to the elementary charge or Planck's constant) remains complex.
  • There is a suggestion that current precision allows for the detection of significant deviations in the fine-structure constant, which could relate to changes in charge.
  • Some participants express that the unitary charge may be considered constant unless significant changes in the fine-structure constant are observed.
  • It is noted that while changes in dimensionless physical constants can be measured, attributing those changes to specific dimensionful constants is not straightforward.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether the unitary charge can change and how such changes could be detected. There is no consensus on the implications of changes to the fine-structure constant or the unitary charge itself.

Contextual Notes

Discussions involve assumptions about the interconnectedness of charges and the implications of changes in fundamental constants, which may not be fully resolved or agreed upon.

minio
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I was trying to think about charge and I am curious. It seems that there is unitary charge - +1 for protons and -1 for electrons. But is it possible to say that it is constant in time? I mean would it be possible to detect changes in unitary charge value? size?

Let us say that all charges are interconnected. So if charge of one proton will change from +1 to +1,5 this will gradualy change all other charges at speed of light, so every electron will change its charge to -1,5, proton to +1,5 and so on over time, would it be possible to detect that such event happened?
 
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You might want to look up "Fractional Quantum Hall Effect". In such experiments, the many-body effects caused the flow of charge to appear as if they are in units of e/3.

So yes, if the unit charge changes, we CAN detect it. There is no reason that we can't.

Zz.
 
The force between charged objects would increase, this can be detected.

If you weaken the electromagnetic force and increase the charge everywhere at the same time by a corresponding amount (and somehow fix the influence of all photons flying around in a similar way), you would not measure any change.
 
minio said:
I mean would it be possible to detect changes in unitary charge value? size?
As long as the fine structure constant changes, yes, we could detect a change. What we could not do is definitely say that the change in the fine structure constant is due to a change in the elementary charge instead of Planck's constant.
 
Last edited:
So if I understand it correctly unitary charge is either constant or we would detect changes in fine structure constant, thus we could assume that unitary charge is constant whaterver charge actually is?
 
The fundamental quantity here is the fine-structure constant. And yes, it would be possible to measure a deviation if it is large enough.
"Large enough" is something like a relative change 10-17/year with current precision (Reference).
 
minio said:
So if I understand it correctly unitary charge is either constant or we would detect changes in fine structure constant, thus we could assume that unitary charge is constant whaterver charge actually is?
Yes. The same is true of all dimensionful physical constants. What we would actually be able to measure would be changes to the dimensionless physical constants, and then we could arbitrarily assign that change to one or more of the dimensionful physical constants that make up the dimensionless constant.
 

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