Application of Fick's First law (diffusion problem)

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Homework Help Overview

The problem involves the application of Fick's First Law in the context of diffusion, specifically examining the steady state concentration of molecules diffusing from a point source in a three-dimensional infinite pool. The scenario includes a given diffusion coefficient and a constant rate of molecule release.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between flux, the rate of molecule release, and the surface area of a sphere. Questions are raised about the validity of assuming that flux equals the rate of molecules added divided by the surface area. There is also a focus on understanding the intuitive nature of diffusion rates in steady state conditions.

Discussion Status

Some participants express confidence in their understanding of the relationship between flux and the rate of molecules entering the sphere. Others seek clarification on the intuitive aspects of diffusion and the implications of steady state, suggesting that if the rates were not equal, it would lead to unrealistic scenarios such as infinite density.

Contextual Notes

Participants are navigating the assumptions inherent in the problem, particularly regarding the nature of steady state and the implications of flux in a diffusion context. There is an acknowledgment of the need for further exploration of these concepts without reaching definitive conclusions.

jokkon
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Homework Statement


Molecules with diffusion coefficient of 1.0 x 10^-10 m^2s^-1 are released at a constant rate of 10^10 molecules/s in the middle of a large pool and dffuse away ( assume the 3-dimensional pool is of infinite size). What is the steady state concentration 1 cm away from the source? [Hint: Consider molecules diffusing out through a spherical surface of radius r, with a source at the centre of the sphere].


Homework Equations


Fick's First law: Flux = -Dgradient(n) with n being the concentration of the molecules


The Attempt at a Solution


I took flux to be equal to the rate at which molecules are being added/surface area of a sphere. Plug it into Fick's first law and then isolate dn/dr (since the source is a point phi and theta should be trivial) and integrate. I have no idea if the assumption that flux = rate/surface area is correct especially since the rate is particles added to the system. If this is not right how should I find the flux? Thank you in advance.
 
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jokkon said:
I took flux to be equal to the rate at which molecules are being added/surface area of a sphere. Plug it into Fick's first law and then isolate dn/dr (since the source is a point phi and theta should be trivial) and integrate. I have no idea if the assumption that flux = rate/surface area is correct especially since the rate is particles added to the system.

It is correct. If n molecules/second are released at the center of the sphere, n molecules/second
must go out through the surface of the sphere after the steady state condition is reached.
you can convert the amount of molecules entereing, the concentration and the flux to mol/second
mol/m^3 and mol/m^2 s, instead of particles/second if you want.
 
thank you for your reply! I am happy that I got it right :D
I can see that all molecules going into the center has to go out of the sphere at some point in time, but the fact that they diffuse out of the sphere at the same rate as the particles entering the system doesn't seem very intuitive to me. Is there any way to show that must be the case?
 
jokkon said:
thank you for your reply! I am happy that I got it right :D
I can see that all molecules going into the center has to go out of the sphere at some point in time, but the fact that they diffuse out of the sphere at the same rate as the particles entering the system doesn't seem very intuitive to me. Is there any way to show that must be the case?

well in the steady state, it seems obvious that they must become the same in the long term, because otherwise the particles would pile up inside the sphere to infinite density, or there would be more coming out then going in.
 

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