Binding Energy per Nucleon trend for fusion vs fission

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the trend of binding energy per nucleon for fusion and fission processes, particularly focusing on the differences in binding energy for elements before and after iron. Participants explore the implications of these differences in the context of nuclear power and the challenges of achieving net power from fusion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant notes that the difference in atomic mass and binding energy per nucleon for deuterium and helium is significant compared to elements past iron, suggesting this is a reason for the challenges in achieving fusion power.
  • Another participant recommends using the Semi-Empirical Mass Formula (SEMF) to understand the trend in binding energy per nucleon, suggesting plotting each term of the SEMF separately to analyze contributions.
  • Concerns are raised about the explanation of how neutrons affect the distance between protons in nuclei, with some participants questioning the clarity of this statement.
  • There is a discussion about the energy density of fusion compared to fission, with one participant emphasizing that the availability of fusion materials and the non-radioactive nature of helium are also important factors.
  • Another participant challenges the notion that nucleons behave like billiard balls, arguing that this analogy does not adequately explain the increase in nucleus size with more nucleons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the reasons behind the trends in binding energy per nucleon, with no consensus reached on the explanations provided. Some participants question the clarity and validity of certain statements, indicating ongoing debate.

Contextual Notes

Some statements rely on assumptions about nuclear structure and behavior that may not be universally accepted. The discussion includes unresolved questions about the specific reasons for the trends observed in binding energy per nucleon.

Guest432
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Hello all!

In my Nuclear Power assignment I decided to analyse this graph:

ae534.gif


I mention that
"The difference in atomic mass and binding energy per nucleon for deuterium and helium (fusion elements) is ≈3u and 5.96 MeV respectively. However, for all elements past Iron (fission elements) the difference in any two binding energies is < 1.3 MeV. Such a vast energy yield, even in comparison to fission, is the reason why obtaining net power from fusion is such a holy grail."

However, I am perplexed as to why exactly the difference in binding energy of elements before Iron is so high! I have discussed the fact neutrons increase the distance between protons in nuclei, so I am taking a guess that elements with a low atomic mass have less neutrons, ergo more repulsive force and greater binding energy. However, this logic seems weak and doesn't really explain why the trend of binding energy per nucleon is what it is.

Thanks :)
 
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Trontor said:
I have discussed the fact neutrons increase the distance between protons in nuclei,
I don't understand that statement.
Trontor said:
Such a vast energy yield, even in comparison to fission, is the reason why obtaining net power from fusion is such a holy grail.
The energy density is not the key point. The atoms used in fusion are also cheap and available everywhere in the world, their fusion product helium is not radioactive and you have no risk of a runaway reaction.
 
mfb said:
I don't understand that statement.The energy density is not the key point. The atoms used in fusion are also cheap and available everywhere in the world, their fusion product helium is not radioactive and you have no risk of a runaway reaction.

Was told this by my physics teacher.
pquuUfW.png


The energy density point is good, but it still doesn't explain to me why exactly the graph trends rapidly upwards then slowly downwards.
 
Ah, well, that is a bit hand-waving, because it does not explain why the size of the nucleus increases with more nucleons. Nucleons are not billard balls, they do not occupy a volume.
Trontor said:
The energy density point is good, but it still doesn't explain to me why exactly the graph trends rapidly upwards then slowly downwards.
That was just meant as comment on commercial applications. See @e.bar.goum's answer for a good model of the shape of that curve.
 

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