Can Relative Velocity Determine Bat's Speed Without Doppler Effect?

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AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around determining the speed of a bat using sound frequency without applying the Doppler effect. A bat at rest emits a sound at 450 kHz, while a flying bat perceives it as 457 kHz. Participants suggest using basic physics formulas, including the relationship between frequency, wavelength, and time, but acknowledge the challenge of avoiding the Doppler effect. The conversation highlights the difficulty of solving the problem without relying on established Doppler equations. Ultimately, the need for a deeper understanding of relative velocity in sound propagation is emphasized.
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Homework Statement



I was thinking about the problem. There is a bat which is at rest and sends a sound of frequncy of 450 khz. another bat flying towards it hears it as a sound of frequency of 457 hz. i was trying to know the velocity of the second bat using simple physics formula or without using doppler's effect or other phenomena.

Homework Equations


i tried to do this by using t= 1/f but to say the truth didnt go any farther. and i don't have any idea about the relevancy. may the v=lambda *frequency and t=1/f will help.

The Attempt at a Solution

 
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Did you look at the equations for the Doppler effect.
 
Ya i have solved using doppler effect. i was thinking if it can be used using relative velocity phenomena.
 
mikhailpavel said:
Ya i have solved using doppler effect. i was thinking if it can be used using relative velocity phenomena.

Have you looked at the derivation of the Doppler formula?
 

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