Comparing an infinite grounded conducting plate to a system of point charges

AI Thread Summary
The discussion centers on comparing the electric potential and field of a point charge near a grounded conducting plate versus a point charge of opposite sign. The potential function is shown to be zero at infinity and on the yz plane for both configurations. The uniqueness theorem indicates that the electric field in the yz plane is identical for both setups, allowing for the calculation of the electric field components. A discrepancy arises in the surface charge density formula, where the textbook's positive result contradicts the expected negative value due to the nature of the conducting plate. Participants agree that the textbook's answer is incorrect, confirming the calculated surface charge density should indeed be negative.
Lisa...
Messages
189
Reaction score
0
A point charge q is a distance d from a grounded conducting plate of infinite extent (figure a). For this configuration the potential V is zero, both at all points infinitely far from the particle in all directions and at all points on the conducting plate. Consider a set of coordinate axes with the particle located on the x-axis at x=d. A second configuration (figure b) has the conducting plane replaced by a particle of charge -q located on the x-axis at x=-d.

http://img130.imageshack.us/img130/3829/naamloos9zt.th.gif

a) Show that for the second configuration the potential function is zero at all points infinitely far from the particle in all directions and at all points on the yz plane- just as was the case for the first configuration.


I've done the following:
V= \Sigma V= V-q= 1 + V+q= 2

V-q= \frac{-kq}{r_1} with r1 is the distance from -q to a certain point P in space (x,y,z)

V+q= \frac{kq}{r_2} with r2 is the distance from +q to a certain point P in space (x,y,z)

V= kq (\frac{1}{r_2} - \frac{1}{r_1})= kq (\frac{r_1-r_2}{r_2 r_1})

***V=0 if r1 r2 = \pm \infty so if r1=r2= \pm \infty

***V=0 is r1-r2=0 so if r1=r2

\sqrt{(x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2}=\sqrt{(x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2}
(x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2=(x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2
(x+d)^2 =(x-d)^2
x^2 + 2xd + d^2= x^2 - 2xd + d^2
2xd= -2xd
4xd=0
x=0, therefore V=0 if x=0, which means V=0 in the whole yz plane.


Okay so far so good, but the trouble starts in the following part:

b) A theorem, called the uniqueness theorem, shows that throughout the half-space x>0 the potential function V- and thus the electric field E- for the two configurations are identical. Using this result, obtain the electric field E at every point in the yz plane in the second configuration. (The uniqueness theorem tells us that in the first configuration the electric field at each point in the yz plane is the same as it is in the second configuration.) Use this result to find the surface charge density \sigma at each point in the conducting plane (in the first configuration)

I've come this far till now:
V= kq (\frac{1}{r_2} - \frac{1}{r_1}= kq (\frac{1}{\sqrt{(x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2}} - \frac{1}{\sqrt{(x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2}})

Ex= - \frac{\delta V}{\delta x}= -kq (\frac{(d-x)}{((x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^1,5)} + \frac{(d+x)}{((x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^\frac{3}{2})} )

Ey= - \frac{\delta V}{\delta y}= -kq (\frac{(-y)}{((x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^1,5)} + \frac{(y)}{((x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^\frac{3}{2})} )

Ez= - \frac{\delta V}{\delta z}= -kq (\frac{(-z)}{((x-d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^1,5)} + \frac{(z)}{((x+d)^2 + y^2 + z^2)^\frac{3}{2})} )

E in the yz plane is when x=0. Substituting x=0 in Ex, Ey and Ez gives:

Ex= -kq \frac{2d}{(d^2 + y^2 + z^2)^\frac{3}{2}}
Ey= 0
Ez= 0

Because r= \sqrt{x^2 + y^2 + z^2}
r^2= x^2 + y^2 + z^2.
In the yz plane x=0, therefore r^2= y^2 + z^2.

Substituting this into Ex gives:
Ex= -kq \frac{2d}{(d^2 + r^2)^\frac{3}{2}}

The x direction is perpendicular to the yz plane, therefore the electric field given by Ex is perpendicular to the infinite yz conductor plane.

The formula for the component of the electric field perpendicular to the conductor is

E_n= \frac{\sigma}{\epsilon_0} therefore
\sigma = E_n \epsilon_0 with
En= Ex=-kq \frac{2d}{(d^2 + r^2)^\frac{3}{2}}
\epsilon_0 = \frac{1}{4 \pi k}

Substituting in the formula of sigma gives:
\sigma= \frac{-kq2d}{4 \pi k (d^2 + r^2)^\frac{3}{2}} = \frac{-qd}{2 \pi (d^2 + r^2)^\frac{3}{2}}

Though my textbook tells me the correct answer should be

\sigma= \frac{qd}{4 \pi (d^2 + r^2)^\frac{3}{2}}

Where did I go wrong? I would REALLY appreciate it if you can help me with this problem. I've checked my work plenty of times, but can't see my mistake.

THANK YOU FOR READING! :biggrin:



 
Last edited by a moderator:
Physics news on Phys.org
Lisa... said:
The formula for the component of the electric field perpendicular to the conductor is

E_n= \frac{\sigma}{\epsilon_0} therefore


[/b]
Shouldn't that be
E_n=\frac{\sigma}{2\epsilon_0}?
 
You are right. The book's answer makes no sense at all, as the charge on the surface of the infinite plane must obviously be negative to counter the positive charge from above. If the charge on the plane were positive, then the field would not at all act like a dipole, unlike the first example.

I double checked your result with the Pollack and Stump E&M book, and my professors notes from going over this problem recently, and they both match your result exactly. Given the book's answer makes no sense physically, you are definitely right.

~Lyuokdea
 
Last edited:
Wow thanks a hell of a lot Lyuokdea! I found it pretty odd indeed that the books answer was positive...
 
I multiplied the values first without the error limit. Got 19.38. rounded it off to 2 significant figures since the given data has 2 significant figures. So = 19. For error I used the above formula. It comes out about 1.48. Now my question is. Should I write the answer as 19±1.5 (rounding 1.48 to 2 significant figures) OR should I write it as 19±1. So in short, should the error have same number of significant figures as the mean value or should it have the same number of decimal places as...
Thread 'A cylinder connected to a hanging mass'
Let's declare that for the cylinder, mass = M = 10 kg Radius = R = 4 m For the wall and the floor, Friction coeff = ##\mu## = 0.5 For the hanging mass, mass = m = 11 kg First, we divide the force according to their respective plane (x and y thing, correct me if I'm wrong) and according to which, cylinder or the hanging mass, they're working on. Force on the hanging mass $$mg - T = ma$$ Force(Cylinder) on y $$N_f + f_w - Mg = 0$$ Force(Cylinder) on x $$T + f_f - N_w = Ma$$ There's also...
Back
Top