Conceptual Difficulty with Lagrange's Eqn

In summary, the conversation discusses a confusion about an equation in spherical polar coordinates and its representation of acceleration. The speaker initially believed the equation to represent the acceleration in the theta component but was corrected by their book. The book states that the expression should be divided by h_theta, which represents the magnitude of the position vector in terms of theta. This leads to the correct expression for acceleration, a_theta. The speaker acknowledges their error and thanks the other person for clarifying.
  • #1
H_man
145
0
I shall give a short example to illustrate where I am confused.

If we take the K.E. of a particle in spherical polar coords.

[tex]
T = \frac{1}{2}m( \dot r^2 + r^2 \dot\theta^2 + r^2 sin^2 \theta \dot \phi^2)
[/tex]

And

[tex]
T' = \frac{1}{2}( \dot r^2 + r^2 \dot\theta^2 + r^2 sin^2 \theta \dot \phi^2)
[/tex]

Now plugging this in Lagrange's equation:
[tex]
\frac {d} {dt} \frac {\partial T'} {\partial \dot \theta} - \frac {\partial T'} {\partial \theta} = r^2 \ddot \theta + 2r \dot r \dot \theta - r^2 \dot \phi^2 sin \theta cos \theta
[/tex] --------- Line 3

Now, as far as I understand the above equation is [tex]a_\theta[/tex]. That is, the [tex]\theta[/tex] component of acceleration.

However, it seems I am wrong.

My book tells me I have to divide the expression by [tex]h_\theta[/tex]

where

[tex]
h_\theta = \left ( \left ( \frac {\partial x} {\partial \theta} \right )^2
+ \left ( \frac {\partial y} {\partial \theta} \right )^2
+ \left ( \frac {\partial z} {\partial \theta} \right )^2 \right )^\frac {1}{2} = ( (r cos \theta cos \phi )^2 + ( (r cos \theta sin \phi )^2 + r^2 sin^2 \theta )^\frac {1}{2} = r
[/tex]

Producing [tex]a_\theta = r \ddot \theta + 2 \dot r \dot \theta - r \dot \phi^2 sin \theta cos \theta [/tex]

So making the reasonable assumption that the book is correct and I am not. What does the expression (Line 3) that I thought was the acceleration represent?

This is especially confusing as I know that if we do not divide T by m then line 3 should produce the force [tex]F_\theta[/tex]??

:frown: :frown: :uhh:
 
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  • #2
A quick check of the units in equation (3) would show that it isn't an aceleration, you have [itex] m^{2} s^{-2} [/itex] not [itex] m s^{-2} [/itex].
 
  • #3
Oops. Yep, you is right. Just had a look at the derivation again and I see where my confusion arose.

School-boy error :blushing:

Thanks muchly!
 

What is conceptual difficulty with Lagrange's equation?

Conceptual difficulty with Lagrange's equation refers to the challenges that scientists and students may face in understanding and applying this mathematical equation, which is used in the study of classical mechanics and other fields of physics.

What is Lagrange's equation used for?

Lagrange's equation is used to describe the motion of a system of particles subject to certain constraints. It allows scientists to analyze and predict the behavior of complex systems in various fields, including mechanics, physics, and engineering.

What are the main components of Lagrange's equation?

The main components of Lagrange's equation are the generalized coordinates, which describe the position of each particle in the system, and the Lagrangian, which represents the total energy of the system. The equation also takes into account the constraints and forces acting on the system.

Why is Lagrange's equation important in physics?

Lagrange's equation is important in physics because it provides a powerful and elegant mathematical framework for analyzing and solving complex problems. It allows scientists to model and understand the behavior of a wide range of systems, from simple pendulums to celestial bodies.

What are some common challenges in understanding Lagrange's equation?

Some common challenges in understanding Lagrange's equation include grasping the concept of generalized coordinates and how they relate to the physical system, correctly applying the constraints and forces, and simplifying the equation for specific problems. Additionally, the mathematical notation and terminology used in Lagrange's equation may also be difficult for some to understand at first.

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