Definitions of parity conservation

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the definitions of parity conservation in quantum mechanics, focusing on the relationship between expectation values of observables and the parity operator. Participants explore the implications of two definitions of parity conservation, examining their equivalence and the conditions under which they hold true.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines parity conservation in terms of the expectation value of the parity operator being constant over time, suggesting that both definitions provided are equivalent.
  • Another participant argues that only observables that commute with the parity operator will have invariant expectation values under parity transformation, challenging the initial equivalence claim.
  • A later reply questions a potential typo regarding the time derivative of the parity operator, suggesting it should refer to the expectation value instead.
  • Further clarification is provided that the parity operator has no intrinsic time dependence, which leads to a discussion on the implications for observables with constant expectation values.
  • One participant asserts that the condition for expectation values to be invariant under parity transformation is that the parity operator must commute with the observable, regardless of whether the expectation value is time-varying.
  • There is a discussion about the implications of commuting operators, with one participant noting that commuting relationships do not necessarily extend transitively among multiple operators.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the equivalence of the two definitions of parity conservation, with some arguing for their equivalence and others highlighting conditions under which they may not hold. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the implications of these definitions and the conditions for observables.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights limitations in understanding the relationship between the parity operator and observables, particularly regarding the assumptions about time dependence and the conditions for invariance under parity transformation.

Happiness
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Definition 1: The expectation value of the observable related to the parity operator ##\hat{P}## is constant over time. That is,

\frac{d}{dt}\langle P\rangle=0
\int\Psi^*(r)\ \hat{P}\ \Psi(r)\ dr=constant
\begin{align}\int\Psi^*(r)\ \Psi(-r)\ dr=constant\end{align}

Definition 2: If the physical process proceeds in exactly the same way when referred to an inverted coordinate system, then parity is said to be conserved. If, on the contrary, the process has a definite handedness, then parity is not conserved in that physical process.

In particular, the expectation values of all observables ##A##'s are invariant under the parity transformation. That is,

\begin{align}\int\Psi^*(r)\ \hat{A}\ \Psi(r)\ dr=\int\Psi^*(-r)\ \hat{A}\ \Psi(-r)\ dr\end{align}

I suppose both definitions are equivalent. How, then, do we prove (1) implies (2) and vice versa?
 
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Happiness said:
In particular, the expectation values of all observables ##A##'s are invariant under the parity transformation. That is,

The expectation values of the observables may not be invariant under the parity transformation. Only those observables which commute with \hat{P} will have invariant expectation values. This can be shown as follows
<br /> \langle \Psi|\hat{A}|\Psi\rangle = \langle \Psi|\hat{A}\hat{P}^\dagger\hat{P}|\Psi\rangle<br />
since parity operator is unitary operator. And now if [\hat{A},\hat{P}^\dagger]=0, then the above expression becomes
<br /> \langle \Psi|\hat{P}^\dagger\hat{A}\hat{P}|\Psi\rangle<br />
which proves the equality of equation 2 in OP.

Now if the time evolution of a physical process is invariant under parity that means [\hat{P},\hat{H}]=0 which further implies \frac{\partial \hat{P}}{\partial t}=0.
 
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Ravi Mohan said:
Now if the time evolution of a physical process is invariant under parity that means [\hat{P},\hat{H}]=0 which further implies \frac{\partial \hat{P}}{\partial t}=0.

Is this a typo? \frac{\partial \hat{P}}{\partial t}=0 should be \frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle P\rangle=0?

In other words, can I say that only for those observables whose expectation values are constant over time, ie., ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0##, are their expectation values invariant under the parity transformation?

By definition 1, ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle P\rangle=0##, which implies ##[\hat{P}, \hat{H}]=0##. Together with ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0##, which implies ##[\hat{A}, \hat{H}]=0##, we have ##[\hat{A}, \hat{P}]=0##, which as shown by you, implies its expectation value is invariant under the parity transformation.

How does this imply definition 2? Restricting the class of observables only to those where ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0## seems to make definition 2 false.
 
Happiness said:
Is this a typo? \frac{\partial \hat{P}}{\partial t}=0 should be \frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle P\rangle=0?
Actually I abused the notation. \frac{\partial \hat{P}_S}{\partial t}=0 because parity has no intrinsic time dependence. The Heisenberg equation implies \frac{\partial\hat{P}_H}{\partial t}=0.

Happiness said:
In other words, can I say that only for those observables whose expectation values are constant over time, ie., ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0##, are their expectation values invariant under the parity transformation?
No.
Happiness said:
By definition 1, ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle P\rangle=0##, which implies ##[\hat{P}, \hat{H}]=0##. Together with ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0##, which implies ##[\hat{A}, \hat{H}]=0##, we have ##[\hat{A}, \hat{P}]=0##, which as shown by you, implies its expectation value is invariant under the parity transformation.
If you have three operators \hat{A}, \hat{B}\text{ and }\hat{C} such that [\hat{A},\hat{B}]=[\hat{B},\hat{C}]=0. Then this does not imply that [\hat{A},\hat{C}]=0.
Happiness said:
How does this imply definition 2? Restricting the class of observables only to those where ##\frac{\partial}{\partial t}\langle A\rangle=0## seems to make definition 2 false.
The condition/restriction for the expectation values to be parity invariant is that the parity operator should commute with the observable (does not matter if the expectation value of the observable is time varying).

Now definition #2 "If the physical process proceeds in exactly the same way when referred to an inverted coordinate system ..." essentially means that parity operator commutes with the Hamiltonian. My earlier response was asserting that definition #2 implies definition #1.
 
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