Derivation of equation for catenary

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    Catenary Derivation
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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the derivation of the catenary equation, specifically the relationship between arc length differential ds, and the Cartesian coordinates dx and dy. The participant expresses confusion regarding the derivation steps, particularly the application of the chain rule and the interpretation of the equation ds² = dx² + dy². A critical point made is that s cannot be expressed as √(x'² + y'²) when given ds² = dx² + dy², emphasizing the need for proper simplification and understanding of derivatives in this context.

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  • Understanding of calculus, particularly differentiation and the chain rule.
  • Familiarity with the concept of arc length in Cartesian coordinates.
  • Knowledge of the catenary curve and its mathematical properties.
  • Ability to manipulate and simplify algebraic expressions involving derivatives.
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  • Study the derivation of the catenary equation in detail, focusing on the relationship between ds, dx, and dy.
  • Learn about the application of the chain rule in calculus, particularly in relation to parametric equations.
  • Explore the geometric interpretation of arc length and its derivation from Cartesian coordinates.
  • Investigate common pitfalls in calculus derivations to avoid confusion in future mathematical problems.
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Students of calculus, mathematicians, and engineers who are working on problems involving the catenary curve and arc length derivations.

demonelite123
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I am a bit confused on one part of the derivation of the catenary equation. At one point my book says ds2 = dx2 + dy2 and thus \frac{ds}{dx}=\sqrt{1 + {y'}^2}.

however that doesn't seem very rigorous to me and i am a little wary of accepting that explanation. i know that s = \sqrt{{x'}^2 + {y'}^2} so i tried to take the derivative of this with respect to x in order to hopefully obtain the same thing as above. so from the chain rule i have \frac{1}{2\sqrt{{x'}^2 + {y'}^2}} and now i have to take the derivative of (x'2 + y'2) with respect to x and here is where i am having trouble.

i have \frac{d}{dx}{x'}^2 = 2x' \frac{d}{dx}\frac{dx}{dt} = 2x' \frac{d}{dt}\frac{dx}{dx} = 0. then i have \frac{d}{dx}{y'}^2 = 2y' \frac{d}{dt}\frac{dy}{dx} = 2y'y''x' which does not seem right to me. it seems like this way should work but i am just confusing the chain rule in this last portion. can someone help straighten this out? thanks.
 
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demonelite123 said:
I am a bit confused on one part of the derivation of the catenary equation. At one point my book says ds2 = dx2 + dy2 and thus \frac{ds}{dx}=\sqrt{1 + {y'}^2}. [...] i know that s = \sqrt{{x'}^2 + {y'}^2}

If you are given ds^2 = dx^2 + dy^2, then s \neq \sqrt{{x'}^2 + {y'}^2}.



Take ds^2 = dx^2 + dy^2, divide it by dx^2 and then simplify. (hint: \frac{dx}{dx} = x' = 1)
 

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