Do you consider masturbation a sin?

[eNtRopY]

All those who think so raise your hand... well, that is after you wash it.

eNtRopY

 

[Iacchus32]

I think if there was any sin involed, it would have more to do with you're motives for doing it, i.e., what kind of mental imagery does it involve and what type of behavior are you trying to justify by doing it?

 

[einsteinian77]

who am I to say what is a sin and what isn't

 

[Les Sleeth]

Originally posted by eNtRopY
All those who think so raise your hand... well, that is after you wash it.

LOL!

Entropy, I am starting to suspect you are a troublemaker, second only to Saint.

 

[eNtRopY]

I'll bet that the three people who voted "yes" are either female or suffer from sexual dysfunction... or both.

eNtRopY

 

[Kerrie]

entropy, i would suggest you edit your stereotyped comment towards females or i will do it for you

 

[eNtRopY]

My point is simply that ALL men masturbate or have at least masturbated.

From what I've read most women masturbate as well... something like 60%. But maybe that just means 40% are lying about it.

eNtRopY

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by eNtRopY
I'll bet that the three people who voted "yes" are either female or suffer from sexual dysfunction... or both.

eNtRopY

Yes, naturally, thinking that maybe they were maybe "married", and led "Spiritual lives", in their 'marriages', would simply be, what?? "honest and thoughtful", Oooooppps!

 

[eNtRopY]

Are you saying that married men don't masturbate?

eNtRopY

 

[Kerrie]

Originally posted by eNtRopY
My point is simply that ALL men masturbate or have at least masturbated.

From what I've read most women masturbate as well... something like 60%. But maybe that just means 40% are lying about it.

eNtRopY

just because a woman chooses not to masturbate doesn't mean she thinks it is sinful...

 

[Andy]

How can something that's good for you be a sin?

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Probably in a similar manner to vitamin A, which, in large enough doses is lethal.

Sexual relations outside of marriage are considered a sort of Spiritual Breach of person.

See 'Morally Turpid' for better understandings of legalities in "Natural Moral Law".

Playing with your teeth with your fingers, if they are hurting, seems to feel good, but it is the best pathway to an infection possibly abcessing. (SP?)

 

[eNtRopY]

I once read an article that said that men who do not ejaculate at least once every two weeks are at a much higher risk of becoming impotent than those who do. So, a moderate amount of masturbation (if sexual intercourse is not available) is actually recommended by most urologists.

I predict that in the future, there will be a smaller percentage of men who suffer from the condition of impotence simply because people are becoming less submissive to traditional religious dogma as time progresses.

eNtRopY

 

[Andy]

It is also supposed to help reduce the risk of getting prostate cancer.

 

[einsteinian77]

What about all the sperm that gets killed per ejaculation. Considering there is about 20-150 million of them per milliliter, that's a lot.

 

[Kerrie]

i think most of today's (american at least) don't seem to think that masturbation is a sin...

 

[Les Sleeth]

Well, if we are going to talk about this seriously, then the fact that someone might even consider masterbation a "sin" tell us a lot. Some fool, a long time ago, decided sex takes us away from God, and needed to be shamed. Big mistake.

Shaming a biological drive that cannot be suppressed without popping up morphed elsewhere almost always leads to some sort of dysfunctional situation.

Christianity can take much of the responsibility for this shaming in Western culture, and it still is quite strong both in fundamentalist doctrine, and among the population. Masterbation, my father told me, gives you pimples (after seeing one on my cheek).

So why would sex be associated with heading away from God (i.e., sin)? Well, the simple answer is that people do tend to get obsessed with what feels good, which is why there are addicts of all varieties. The thought was, I believe, that rather than take the chance of getting obsessed with something that feels so good, reject it. After all, hell is the danger one faces! Of course, that's if one buys all the silliness of hell and sin.

Why would God care if we fool around or masterbate? It's trivial! In both cases we have the means to do it safely and within the boundaries of a relationship. Besides, if God is really wise, then he/she/it had to have known something that feels so good is going to be done all the time by we little feel-good machines.

So I say, masterbate if you want, if it helps. For some people the sex drive is so intense they'd go nuts if they didn't have that release, married or not. As long as no one is harmed, I can't see what's wrong with it. Some married couples even work that into their relationship with the goal of enjoying their mate's sexuality fully.

And what if one is trying to get close to God? Well, maybe one day, when the drive has settled down, and you want to focus less on sex, then that can happen too. I really don't think God would mind at all someone being horny if one is equally or more passionate in their inner devotion.

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

It would be something alone the lines of "just what" are you learning in having multiple partners.

NOT the intimacy that is available to two people who select to stay with each other, exclusively, but the "mulitiplicity of partnerings" that arises from having indulged, in you heart, in a plenitude of personality types, (but by visual judgment alone) without their personalities present, such that, your judgmental abilities are waaaaay off when it comes to crunch (actual selection) time.

Spent so many a days dreaming of a "Perfect Body" image in your brain, and it might not be even close to what is actually the right 'character' type for you, never mind 'body' type, 'personality' type etc.

A good (possible) pathway of self deception, leading yourself astray, if I ever heard of one.

But clearly, it's been in the local papers, it's agreed, it is good for you health wise, just people need pay respect to the spiritual, else they become lost, even more then they already are.

Choose for yourself, that way you are respocible!

 

[eNtRopY]

Originally posted by Mr. Robin Parsons
Choose for yourself, that way you are respocible!

... and that's one to grow on...

* sparkling banner appears with caption that says the more you know *

* dee dee dee dee *

eNtRopY

 

[eNtRopY]

Originally posted by Andy
So you have never "spanked the monkey", "bashed the bishop", "helped the one eyed milkman", or "slapped the solami"?

What are you talking about? He does that everytime he thinks he slamming us in the General Forums.

eNtRopY

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by eNtRopY
What are you talking about? He does that everytime he thinks he slamming us in the General Forums.

eNtRopY

And with this lovely commnet eNtRopY 'titles' all of his mates, ascribing to them the characteristic of being the object that gets the slappin!

Nice to know just how you think of your friends there ent.

Originally posted by Andy
So you have never "spanked the monkey", "bashed the bishop", "helped the one eyed milkman", or "slapped the solami"?

Andy, I am 47 years old, so yes! I have!
(To pretend differently, well, that would be stupid/idiotic)

PS Andy you forgot (or don't know?) several of the expressions, to state the least!

 

[Andy]

I guessed i had missed out on some, but you obviously have more experience than me when it comes to "polishing your tool".

 

[Les Sleeth]

Originally posted by Andy
So you have never "spanked the monkey", "bashed the bishop", "helped the one eyed milkman", or "slapped the solami"?

Andy, since you failed to include women's terms on that list, it is blatently sexist.

Kerrie . . . are you going to deal with this?

 

[Les Sleeth]

Originally posted by Mr. Robin Parsons
It would be something alone the lines of "just what" are you learning in having multiple partners.

NOT the intimacy that is available to two people who select to stay with each other, exclusively, but the "mulitiplicity of partnerings" that arises from having indulged, in you heart, in a plenitude of personality types, (but by visual judgment alone) without their personalities present, such that, your judgmental abilities are waaaaay off when it comes to crunch (actual selection) time.

Spent so many a days dreaming of a "Perfect Body" image in your brain, and it might not be even close to what is actually the right 'character' type for you, never mind 'body' type, 'personality' type etc.

A good (possible) pathway of self deception, leading yourself astray, if I ever heard of one.

But clearly, it's been in the local papers, it's agreed, it is good for you health wise, just people need pay respect to the spiritual, else they become lost, even more then they already are.

Choose for yourself, that way you are respocible!

Yes, but people fantasize about the "perfect" partner whether they masterbate or not. That is not only a sexual thing, it's also part of people wanting to be with someone they can love, share with, and legitimately lust after.

As far as what someone learns by fantasizing about "a plentitude of partners," why do we have to learn from everything we do? Some things I do just for pure enjoyment, and I don't see why pleasuring myself can't be one of them.

The problem, as I see it, is attaching any sort of morality to sex. That leads to the sense of shame which in our culture has either stifled a healthy sexual life, or made someone want sex more than they naturally would if left alone. Sex is not "good" or "bad" morally, it is simply part of our nature.

But leaving morality out of it doesn't mean there aren't practical consideratons. It may not be "bad" to screw everybody in town or masterbate all day long, but it definitely can cause one problems.

I would love to see people drop all the moralistic high-ground crap about sex, and just have fun with it. If we did that, and without hurting others or oneself, then I say Western culture would be a lot healthier sexually (and we are NOT that healthy when it comes to sex).

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by LW Sleeth
(SNIP) As far as what someone learns by fantasizing about "a plentitude of partners," why do we have to learn from everything we do? (SNoP)

Well, it is something about "Learning from Everything that you Do", otherwise you are, really, purposefully, wasting your own time.

(In My opinion)

As for the fantasizing about a "Perfect Partner", leads to dis-satisfaction, with whomever you end up with, as they will never meet that standard, so you are setting yourself up for failure!??

 

[Andy]

Andy, since you failed to include women's terms on that list, it is blatently sexist.

Anyone else would apolagise for such blatent sexism.

 

[cmdr_sponge]

some would add suggestions to balance the argument. consider 'flicking the bean'.

 

[eNtRopY]

Administrator:

Thank you for cutting my perfectly non-offensive reply. It's nice the way you let certain individuals casually throw around insults, yet you won't let me tell someone to simply grow up.

eNtRopY

 

[BoulderHead]

Originally posted by eNtRopY
I once read an article that said that men who do not ejaculate at least once every two weeks are at a much higher risk of becoming impotent than those who do. So, a moderate amount of masturbation (if sexual intercourse is not available) is actually recommended by most urologists.
eNtRopY

Originally posted by Andy
It is also supposed to help reduce the risk of getting prostate cancer.

Ok, here is what I’ve been told about it;
The concern is not about impotence, it’s about prostate cancer. Your ejaculations need to be regular, not sporadic. The frequency was not as important as just being sure you kept them on schedule. In other words, and to display it graphically;

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
This is Ok

**********************************
So is this

* *** ** * * ***** * * * ** ** * *** ** *
But this is not Ok.

Here’s another story for you;
One Crazy man I knew claimed that another ‘secret’ (beside the one previously mentioned and Saw Palmetto) was trying to expel as much fluid from the prostate as possible when ejaculating. He recommended the ‘Dog-Style’ claiming it worked best at getting this job done. Now, he had prostate cancer and even though his tilly was dripping blood and his urethra had been pinched closed by the swelling such that he had to self-insert a catheter each time he needed to urinate, he refused to get ‘re-plumbed’ (if you know what I mean: he feared losing his prostate and being rendered impotent). He lived with this condition for over a decade and I’m not sure if he has died yet or not, having lost contact with him now for a good many years…

Originally posted by einsteinian77
What about all the sperm that gets killed per ejaculation. Considering there is about 20-150 million of them per milliliter, that's a lot.

Yes, that is a lot, but think about it;
Even when conception occurs nearly all those millions die, and many times no conception occurs at all. Perhaps more death and destruction take place than is tolerable each time the ol’ fountain goes off despite the location of the spout?

… That tears it; I demand a ban on ALL ejaculations !

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by BoulderHead

… That tears it; I demand a ban on ALL ejaculations !

Cheese, what are you going to give me if I tell you that I killed a mosquito, the other morning, in my tent. One of "The Fat and the Fed" that hang around, then try to get out when I open the screening.

Got blood all over my hand when I knocked it forwards, and then snatched it out of the air, squishing it, Irony was, it was my blood![/color]

Scared of what this dudes a going to do to me, that's for shhhuure!

 

[megashawn]

I find it interesting that if you look at the bible for the answer to this, not only is it considered a sin, but it is better to sleep with a prostitute then to masterbate.

Poor lot got caught doing the solo nasty, and God killed him for it.

I believe that is where the line "Don't spill your seed on the floor" came from.

Then, either that same story or maybe in deuteronomy (Spelling) it says "Your seed is better in the belly of a whore then spilled out on the ground".


So, does this mean if we all adopt a christian point of view that prostitution can become legal and I can finally pursue my dream of being a pimp?

Wheres my baby powder?

 

[Andy]

Administrator:

Thank you for cutting my perfectly non-offensive reply. It's nice the way you let certain individuals casually throw around insults, yet you won't let me tell someone to simply grow up.

eNtRopY

I agree, i am sure that i posted a non offensive reply, it was so obvious that it was a joke that (evidently almost) everyone would have laughed and not taken offense to it.

 

[BoulderHead]

...Then, either that same story or maybe in deuteronomy (Spelling) it says "Your seed is better in the belly of a whore then spilled out on the ground".

It has been a while since I wasted any time reading scripture, but there is no passage I know of in the Bible saying that. It appears to have been derived in part from the story of Onan, who cast his seed on the ground rather than shoot same into his brother’s wife… (He had no probs doing his dead brother’s wife, apparently, but didn’t want to impregnate the woman). More for failing in his duty to extend his Brother’s line did the evil-one strike him dead, than because he ‘spilled it’ on the ground. The moral of the story;
When god and custom/law command you to ejaculate, you’re supposed to shout “how much, and where?”

 

[Andy]

The moral of the story;
When god and custom/law command you to ejaculate, you’re supposed to shout “how much, and where?”

So what your saying is that God is a porn film director! And that the film is life, so therefore life must be one big porn film!

 

[megashawn]

ya, i got the names confused. I can't find the stuff I'm reffering to, but I'll get that info soon.


To life being a porn flic, do you think there is any chance of us starting a religion based on this interpretation?

 

[Kerrie]

if you read your PF guidelines prior to registering, you would know that the admin or mentor of the forum has the right to edit content in which she or he chooses...so i took that liberty...if the topic continues to sway from the the question posed, i can always lock it as well...

 

[Iacchus32]

Originally posted by megashawn
I find it interesting that if you look at the bible for the answer to this, not only is it considered a sin, but it is better to sleep with a prostitute then to masterbate.

Poor lot got caught doing the solo nasty, and God killed him for it.

I believe that is where the line "Don't spill your seed on the floor" came from.

Actually I don't think this was Lot you're referring to here. It was Onan, the son of Judah, whose brother Er had been killled by "the Lord" for being wicked, and Onan was supposed to marry Er's wife and bring up a son in Er's name. And Onan married her and had intercourse with her, but instead of fulfilling his obligation, he spilled his seed on the ground. Which so displeased the Lord that he slew Onan as well. So this obviously is not referring to masturbation here (Genesis 38:1-10). Or, maybe he didn't have intercourse with her? It's a bit hard to tell the way the verse is worded? Either way he didn't fulfill his obligation (whether he was masturbating or not).

Then, either that same story or maybe in deuteronomy (Spelling) it says "Your seed is better in the belly of a whore then spilled out on the ground".

Am not familiar with this verse here, but suspect it's along the same lines as above.

So, does this mean if we all adopt a christian point of view that prostitution can become legal and I can finally pursue my dream of being a pimp?

Wheres my baby powder?

LOL!

 

[Doc]

Considering the number of times on average it takes to conceive anyway, it seems like 'spilling the seed' should be somewhat irrelevant considering the number of seeds that are 'wasted' on intercourse that doesn't result in conception and the seeds that aren't the one to get there first.

To Mr. Parsons:

I would say that the reason why people form ideas in their heads of what their mate should be like is based on what they are taught. It doesn't have a damn thing to do with masturbation. The way parents talk about other people maybe commenting on what they look like or any number of things have more to do with it than masturbation. When I had sex for the first time and the times after that I certainly wasn't 'let down' because it wasn't what I had built it up to be. I knew it wasn't going to be how I imagined because 99% of the time NOTHING IS. Anyone who has problems because sex is not what they thought it would be has issues. They are apparently so conceited that they can't imagine not knowing something so they have built it up to something it isn't and can't stand the fact that they were wrong. I would say that those who masturbate are going to be more at ease, calm, accepting, etc. with their sex life in years to come. It shows that they were curious to know and wanting to learn and not 'masturbatingly abstinent' either because they thought they knew it all and didn't need to learn or they were AFRAID to learn because of the BS they have been told.

 

[Doc]

I will agree with eNtRopY. Although I will try to be more tactful. Nothing personal eNt, I just haven't been put through the BS that you have since I have posted here ALOT less. Personally I don't see what is the big deal of threads getting a little off topic. With a yes or no question as this thread is based on, I don't think it would be much of a thread if we weren't allowed to broaden the discussion. If this becomes the case though it is unlikely I will continue to frequent physics forums. To control posting THAT MUCH sounds like someone somewhere, and I am not naming any names because I have seen it in other areas besides this one, has a control freek problem.

 

[eNtRopY]

Originally posted by BoulderHead
It has been a while since I wasted any time reading scripture, but there is no passage I know of in the Bible saying that. It appears to have been derived in part from the story of Onan, who cast his seed on the ground rather than shoot same into his brother’s wife… (He had no probs doing his dead brother’s wife, apparently, but didn’t want to impregnate the woman). More for failing in his duty to extend his Brother’s line did the evil-one strike him dead, than because he ‘spilled it’ on the ground. The moral of the story;
When god and custom/law command you to ejaculate, you’re supposed to shout “how much, and where?”

If anything, I would interpret this story as being a message that God doesn't want you to ejaculate for pleasure. This of course would include sexual recreation with one's own wife.

Then again, there are people out there who enjoy living their lives according to the unexplained dogma of an overbearing tyrant. I think they're the same people who enjoy being censored in this forum.

eNtRopY

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

If I recall the Biblical story properly it was a man who agreed to impregnate his living brothers wife, who was, at that time, incapable of performing the task himself. He made this agreement, with his brother, but reneged on the agreement, at the moment of climax, ("Spilling his seed on the ground") because he liked sleeping with his brothers wife,and wanted to continue to do so, that was why God killed him, because he broke his word to his brother.

Doc I suspect that you have missed the point I was trying to make, because, in fantasy, people develop certain expectations, while fantasizing they develop reactive abiltiies and react to the stimuli that they employ to arouse themselves. Hence in futur encounters they will, (unsuspectingly/unawares) look for the same things that have aroused them in the past, from their fantasy life, which may not be what they really need at all, it might actually be the thing that keeps them from exploring/finding the right people for the encounters they would wish/want to have.

Further is the simple reality of "Lusting in your Heart" unprovable what the consequences of that actually are, but I can assure you, they are there.

 

[Les Sleeth]

Originally posted by Mr. Robin Parsons
Well, it is something about "Learning from Everything that you Do", otherwise you are, really, purposefully, wasting your own time.

Nonesense . . . it is not a waste of time to let off steam, find ways to unwind, relax. You may learn something from doing that, but it isn't the main focus. There are plenty of things we do where the main purpose it to maintain or improve health, and not to learn. And we very much need activities like that. If masterbation happens to be one of them, so what?

Condescending, self-righteous platitudes are really a turn off. Nothing makes people want to misbehave more than all the moralizing laid on them, especially by people who if you could follow them in their everyday life would prove unqualified to preach to anybody. Think of what turned Jesus' stomach the most . . . hypocracy.

Originally posted by Mr. Robin Parsons
As for the fantasizing about a "Perfect Partner", leads to dis-satisfaction, with whomever you end up with, as they will never meet that standard, so you are setting yourself up for failure!??

Ever heard of visualization? Mostly kidding there, but c'mon man, lighten up. When you don't have a partner, about all you can do is fantasize. What should people do, fantasize about someone they consider ugly?

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by LW Sleeth
Condescending, self-righteous platitudes are really a turn off. Nothing makes people want to misbehave more than all the moralizing laid on them, especially by people who if you could follow them in their everyday life would prove unqualified to preach to anybody. Think of what turned Jesus' stomach the most . . . hypocracy.

Curiosity, is this directed (referencing?) towards me?

 

[Doc]

Believe me Parsons, after I have 'done the deed alone' my mind is more clear in what I want/need than ever. The feelings of lust are intensified without that release. Those feelings cloud judgement. So, in a sense what you are saying is to refrain from strokin', fall for the first thing that comes along since your mind will be pretty clouded in what you want/need (at least mine would be), hook up, get married, realize that you aren't with the person you thought, live your life in misery, be tempted to cheat on your spouse or divorce, etc. etc. A comittment of mariage is for LIFE. Why would you cloud judgement on whom you are going to pick?

You could argue that in real 2 person sex you are subconciously expecting something that doesn't exist in the real world. Maybe you are. But CONCIOUSLY you know that you don't know what to expect because you have never done it before. My first time with another person was NOT AT ALL like I had imagined. It was much better in a lot of ways but not so good in some ways since first times are always awkward. Anyone whose 2 person sex life doesn't live up to their one person sex life either has an incredibly wild imagination or isn't doing something right, which is hard to believe. And anyone who has THAT WILD of an imagination and can't live with reality probably has other issues going on.

It has been said that every mans fantasy is to be with 2 women at the same time. In reality, that doesn't happen as much as a lot of guys would want. NICE guys respect their girls wishes since a marriage is give and take. BOTH sides have to agree. If not, it doesn't happen. A person could take this a lot farther than masturbation. An inventor should not invent because he/she will be imagining what the end product will be. Alot of inventions never turn out. "Oh damn, my imagination once again succeeded my end result. I'm ruined for life." Grow the f u c k up. Life is not all cheery and what most of us expected. Once a person learns this it is a lot easier.

 

[Andy]

Originally posted by Rob
Doc I suspect that you have missed the point I was trying to make

I think everyone missed the point that you where trying to make, just like the rest of your posts.

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by Doc
Believe me (Mr.Robin) Parsons, after I have 'done the deed alone' my mind is more clear in what I want/need than ever. (SNoP)

Funny because after you have done the dead as you so colorfully(?) call it, you should be sated, hence you mind would not be "clearer on what you need", as that has supposedly been satisfied, but apparently you haven't 'sated' it just yet, or something.(?)

Originally posted by andy

I think everyone missed the point that you where trying to make, just like the rest of your posts.

Funny did they elect you "head of representation"? as you seem to think you can speak for "all" of the rest of the poeple here, not surprising that you would willingly try to make such a false representation.

Aside from that andy, apparently you are still proving to all, just what a wretched little deciept you are, still reading me. What a silly little boy.

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by Doc
It has been said that every mans fantasy is to be with 2 women at the same time. In reality, that doesn't happen as much as a lot of guys would want. NICE guys respect their girls wishes since a marriage is give and take. BOTH sides have to agree. If not, it doesn't happen. A person could take this a lot farther than masturbation. An inventor should not invent because he/she will be imagining what the end product will be. Alot of inventions never turn out. "Oh damn, my imagination once again succeeded my end result. I'm ruined for life." Grow the f * * k up. Life is not all cheery and what most of us expected. Once a person learns this it is a lot easier

Just what the heck is this supposed to mean?? other then self contradicting, silly, nonsense that is about as meaningful as having to endure someone (like you) passing gas.

As for Grow up, YUP you should!

EDIT SP!

PS your analogy is really rather silly, and way off!

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I just read somewhere that regular masterbation can reduce the chances of getting several cancers in the genital area.

 

[Doc]

Mr. Robin Parsons: My comment about growing up was not directly aimed at you. Although after rereading my post I can see how you could read it that way and I am sorry for that. The comment was aimed at those who feel that real life has not lived up to their fantasy. That IS what your whole point of view is based on.

As for being sated: As defined by Webster, it could be described as full or complete gratification. Yeah, that's the point. Sexual desires can be quenched by most anyone of the opposite sex, but not necessarily the right person for you. With those desires out of the way one can concentrate on OTHER important aspects of a possible relationship or marriage such as whether your partner will be understanding, a good parent, good provider, I really don't need to name anything else. So like I said before, if the desires are left pent up, you stand a better chance of hooking up with someone who is not right for you. My whole point is that unreleased sexual desires tend to cloud judgement. Who wants to go through life making important decisions impaired? As for one of Websters other definitions of sated (if that is the one you are referring to) I seriously doubt the weariness or almost impaired state of mind lasts a few minutes after sex as opposed to sexual desires that last for days or weeks without relief.

As for your question about "Just what the heck is this supposed to mean??" concerning some mens fantasy with two women:

What I am stating is that there is a perfect example of a fantasy unfulfilled. Is it the number one reason for divorce? You decide. Sorry I wasn't more 'clear'.

I also now assume that you don't 'pass gas'. I guess you are above that. Can you come up with something more original than that?

 

[Mr. Robin Parsons]

Originally posted by Doc
As for your question about "Just what the heck is this supposed to mean??" concerning some mens fantasy with two women:

I was referring to this piece of your writing...

Originally posted by Doc
An inventor should not invent because he/she will be imagining what the end product will be. Alot of inventions never turn out. "Oh damn, my imagination once again succeeded my end result. I'm ruined for life."

Which, to me, is basically nonsense, as the syntax of it doesn't even follow sense...just a poorly executed analogy, I suppose(?)...

Anyays I agree with the direction Greg gives us, anyone else read or heard of it possibly reducing the risks of cancers, I had read some about the (possible) risk reductions in prostate cancer...