Karma & Easy Majors: Is College Worth It?

[tt2348]

Personally, I just don't think other majors are as mentally exhausting.
This is how I explain it to my friends.

If you're writing a paper all night long, some of it may be bad, but it's not like you need to rewrite the whole thing, just fix some things.

Math and physics? I can pull an all nighter working on a problem, and the next morning realize I made a mistake and be no closer to solving it than I was the day before. It's like trying to drive somewhere that's 3 hours out of the way, and accidentally driving 2 hours in the wrong direction. The intellectual rigor required for these fields is very intense

 

[story645]

If you're writing a paper all night long, some of it may be bad, but it's not like you need to rewrite the whole thing, just fix some things.

I get students who missed the question and therefore have to rewrite the whole thing all the time. It's a matter of skill and talent, just like the sciences/maths.

 

[tt2348]

Lol we aren't allowed to rewrite.
My point is , math follows Boolean logic. It's either right or wrong

 

[story645]

Lol we aren't allowed to rewrite.

It's the writing center. They usually come in before the assignment is due.

 

[Moonbear]

Easy as in easy. There's some universities where being a history major is a joke, some where it's hard as hell. Typically one thinks of biology as a hard science but at my university it's fairly simple from what I hear. The math department is a JOKE. The department makes the major easy or hard in my opinion.

I think that is the crux of the issue more so than a particular subject or major being hard or easy. Universities each have their strengths and weaknesses in terms of which departments have their best faculty, and which just make courses harder than they need to be, or easier than they should be.

This doesn't really become apparent until you've attended or worked at multiple universities.

And, it does come around if someone attends a university that gives them weak preparation in their major compared to other universities. Employers know where they get their best employees from, graduate programs know which schools are most competitive. This is of course why we recommend, over and over again, when students are selecting universities that they look at the rigor of the specific major or majors they are considering rather than the name brand of the school as a whole.

One example of a major that I know varies greatly from university to university is psychology. There are schools where a psych major is still predominantly going to learn things like Freudian and Jungian theories, and it really isn't a very useful major. Then, there are universities where the major is strongly grounded in biology, neuroscience, even computer science, and is a very rigorous program. And, then there are places where you can choose from these different tracks, and the rigor/difficulty/usefulness of the major is highly dependent on the choices the student makes in which of the elective courses for the major they take.

 

[Moonbear]

And about pre-meds. Get off their case. Many of those ppl will go to med-school, which is one of the *hardest* schools ever. When their are finished, they'll go on for a very though residency period. In my country is 5 years. Probably it's duration is similar in US.
Don't make statements about future MDs that they don't want to be educated. Many will end up learning more than in any other profession I know. And besides, have you ever took a physiology class , or an anatomy class ? The sheer volume alone of what you learn only in those classes can be overwhelming for many.

The pre-meds are preoccupied with grades because they know if they let that point slide that they might have deserved but didn't bother arguing for, that could be the subtle distinction between them and another student who did argue for it when it comes time for med school admission.

I think it's fairly sad, though, that too often people who have never taken any biology course other than introductory biology (usually the one that's not for biology majors, and they're taking it later than their freshman year to fill some core requirement) decide based on that one course that biology is an easy major. That would be like all of the rest of us who took the general physics course for science majors other than physics deciding physics is a cake-walk major based on how easy that one course was. Yes, a freshman level course for non-majors is going to be a relatively easy course. It doesn't mean the higher level courses taught to the majors are so easy.

And, actually, a lot of the pre-meds DON'T make it to med school. Most realize early enough that they aren't cut out for it. The rest find out later when they apply. And then some that make it to med school don't finish med school...we lose several in the first year every year. And, they learn quickly that their old habits of begging for points don't get them very far anymore. Once in a while they can make a good argument for a particular answer they gave, but it's rare. Their patients won't care if they can rationalize their wrong answers, if they make the wrong choice, wrong diagnosis or give the wrong treatment, the patient is still going to sue them and win.

 

[DanP]

The pre-meds are preoccupied with grades because they know if they let that point slide that they might have deserved but didn't bother arguing for, that could be the subtle distinction between them and another student who did argue for it when it comes time for med school admission.

I think it's safe to say that it's good to be preoccupied with your grades, and nobody should hold a grudge against you if you are. Anytime something makes a difference in later competition / career should be treated with attention. Regardless of this, I think it's very unfair to treat pre-med like they where in this thread , and make statements "those are the future doctors who will treat me / my child / whoever?"

In my country the med school stands on it's own, it's not in the pre-med / med format. After you are admitted you do 6 years 3 pre-clinical, 3 clinical. And of course, there are serious differences in value between different university. But in the end, this reflects later on what jobs you are able to get. I know MDs who didn't made a good careers as a doctor and later switched to marketing careers for pharmaceutical companies. They found something to do even if they couldn't survive practice.

 

[~christina~]

I was taking a literary studies class and during a break, one of them complained that they had a 3.9 GPA and wanted a 4.0. All I can say is that their major wasn't in the sciences.

 

[Monique]

And what do you want to say with that?

 

[Pythagorean]

Performing Arts

Performing arts are tough. I had a music minor when I was first pursuing a BA in Physics. I eventually dropped the music minor and went for a BS in Physics.

But anyway, it was hard. The theoretical part of music involves math/logic-like thinking (there are many kinds of patterns, rules, corollaries, etc). And then there's ear training, which takes a lot of practice, staying up late, to be able to sing notes as you see them on sheet music.

Sheet music reading itself is difficult to do on demand. I can read sheet music, but not fast enough to play it. But I've always been more of an improv musician rather than a music reader.

Anyway, I dropped the music minor, not because it was too easy (it was, in fact, very difficult) but because I wanted to be able to enjoy making music, not feel obligated to do it for an assignment.

Literary Studies, History, Politics

Also tough. I can't bring myself to wade through pages of text. This is what is easier about mathematics and physics to me. You don't have near as much text to read. Most of the ideas are contained in an equation or diagram or algorithm with a couple words for definition and operation. It's much easier to comprehend this technical aspect of learning physics and mathematics than it is to pull together abstract concepts from full pages of text.

 

[Gokul43201]

Some days I really do hope karma exists and all my hard work will result in at least a decent paying job that I enjoy.

Karma doesn't quite work that way in Physics. Beyond a point, there is almost a negative correlation between academic qualification and pay. Consider the case of someone graduating with a PhD in Physics (in the US). The most qualified (or lucky) land a postdoc at a top university program, paying somewhere in the range of $30K-$40K. Next down the prestige ladder is a postdoc at a National Lab or less fancy school, paying near $50K-$60K. If you're not good enough or fortunate enough for either of these, you may find an industry position for $60K-$70K. Or, if none of these work out, you could find yourself a job as a quant on Wall Street with a nearly 6-figure starting paycheck.

PS: This post is a bit of an overgeneralization. I know plenty of people who would (and did) take an industry position any day over an academic one, for instance.

 

[rootX]

Karma doesn't quite work that way in Physics. Beyond a point, there is almost a negative correlation between academic qualification and pay. Consider the case of someone graduating with a PhD in Physics (in the US). The most qualified (or lucky) land a postdoc at a top university program, paying somewhere in the range of $30K-$40K. Next down the prestige ladder is a postdoc at a National Lab or less fancy school, paying near $50K-$60K. If you're not good enough or fortunate enough for either of these, you may find an industry position for $60K-$70K. Or, if none of these work out, you could find yourself a job as a quant on Wall Street with a nearly 6-figure starting paycheck.

PS: This post is a bit of an overgeneralization. I know plenty of people who would (and did) take an industry position any day over an academic one, for instance.

If you want (6 figures) money (badly), why would you consider PhD in Physics?

 

[lisab]

If you want (6 figures) money (badly), why would you consider PhD in Physics?

You can easily make 6 figures in with a degree in physics...if you count the cents columns.

 

[Gokul43201]

You can easily make 6 figures in with a degree in physics...if you count the cents columns.

Physicist A (scribbling out what he earns, in dollars and cents): See, I make a 6-figure salary!

Physicist B: Okay, but where's the point in that?

 

[~christina~]

And what do you want to say with that?

It's just an example of how some individuals are not appreciative of how it's easy for them to get a perfect GPA. (sort of frustrating to listen to) It's also probably worth mentioning that this was a senior that was speaking.

disclaimer: I'm most likely biased in this category

 

[story645]

It's also probably worth mentioning that this was a senior that was speaking

I think it depends on the person though, 'cause I've heard plenty of crazy honors kid in science/math engineering also whine about having only a 3.9.

Also grading is just plain wonky. I had a professor who never gave anything above a B+ (she believed in writing her tests so that the grades would be normally distributed and graded her tests so that they'd be normally distributed) and this was a psychology course, and I've had two engineering professors who seemed to grade on how smart they thought a student was. (One, a guy who gave almost everybody As, was finally not allowed to teach a class anymore, rumor has it 'cause the next professor in the sequence complained about getting his students. )

 

[Monique]

It's just an example of how some individuals are not appreciative of how it's easy for them to get a perfect GPA. (sort of frustrating to listen to) It's also probably worth mentioning that this was a senior that was speaking.

disclaimer: I'm most likely biased in this category

Yes, I think you are biased. There are also people in the sciences that would be disappointed with a GPA of 3.9 (like story645 also mentioned). If science is about a clear distinction in right or wrong, it should be easy to get perfect grades: you just study and answer the questions correctly.

In the end it is not how 'easy' a major it, it is about people being passionate about what they're learning and putting it to good use.