Extremely low on resistance LDR?

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    Ldr Resistance
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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the use of Light Dependent Resistors (LDRs) as variable AC attenuators, specifically focusing on achieving very low on resistance values, ideally under 10 ohms. Participants explore circuit requirements, alternative solutions, and the limitations of LDRs in this application.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses a need for an LDR with an on resistance lower than 10 ohms, noting that available LDRs typically have a minimum resistance of 100 ohms.
  • Another participant asks for more details about the circuit requirements, suggesting that there are other methods for creating variable attenuators.
  • Voltage requirements are discussed, with one participant indicating a range from -600 to 0 volts and a current requirement of 0-100 mA.
  • Audio frequencies are specified as the context for the application, which involves an amplifier needing adjustable impedance at a DC bias point.
  • A participant reports issues with simulating a MOSFET in LTspice, questioning whether the simulation results are accurate or a glitch.
  • Concerns about the capacitance of LDRs are raised, with one participant recalling a previous idea of using them in a pi network configuration but noting potential unsuitability due to internal capacitance.
  • Another participant references a datasheet showing a 5 pF capacitance for LDRs, suggesting it may not significantly affect frequency response, but reiterates the concern about on resistance.
  • One participant optimally desires an on resistance under 1 ohm, indicating a need for the lowest possible resistance.
  • There is a request for a schematic to better understand the circuit, but the original poster declines to share due to the proprietary nature of their project.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the feasibility of solving the problem through forum discussions without sharing detailed information.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the challenges of using LDRs for low resistance applications, but multiple competing views remain regarding potential solutions and circuit configurations. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best approach to achieve the desired attenuation.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence on specific circuit requirements, the potential impact of LDR capacitance on frequency response, and the unresolved nature of the simulation issues in LTspice.

coinmaster
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I need a variable AC attenuator and the only thing I can think of is an LDR.
However I would need the on resistance to be very low, less than 10 ohms.

I've only found LDRs with on resistances of 100ohms minimum.
Is it possible to go lower than the listed minimum is I use a really really bright light?
 
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coinmaster said:
I need a variable AC attenuator and the only thing I can think of is an LDR.
However I would need the on resistance to be very low, less than 10 ohms.

I've only found LDRs with on resistances of 100ohms minimum.
Is it possible to go lower than the listed minimum is I use a really really bright light?
Can you say more about your circuit requirements? There are other ways to make variable attenuators. What are your voltage and current requirements?
 
berkeman said:
Can you say more about your circuit requirements? There are other ways to make variable attenuators. What are your voltage and current requirements?

Hmmm, voltage requirements will probably be very wide, from -600 to 0v maybe. Current will be 0-100ma.
 
coinmaster said:
Hmmm, voltage requirements will probably be very wide, from -600 to 0v maybe. Current will be 0-100ma.
You said "AC attenuator". What frequencies? Can you say what the application is? What range of attenuation do you need?
 
Audio frequencies. The application is an amplifier where I need an adjustable impedance at a DC bias point. The DC adjustment will be done via a source follower but the signal needs a separately adjustable attenuation.
 
I tried using a mosfet in LTspice in parallel with a resistor to create a variable resistance but for some reason it never reaches the source voltage when the resistance becomes zero. For example if the source voltage is 100v then at zero resistance the other size of the resistor should be 100v, but it comes out much lower. Is this a glitch in LTspice or is there some reason for this?
 
coinmaster said:
Audio frequencies. The application is an amplifier where I need an adjustable impedance at a DC bias point. The DC adjustment will be done via a source follower but the signal needs a separately adjustable attenuation.
Can you post a block diagram of what you are trying to do?
 
Screenshot_5.png

Source follower sets the bias voltage for the load. I need to adjust the AC signal as well, hence my problem.
 
Last edited:
coinmaster said:
https://www.physicsforums.com/attachments/96634
Source follower sets the bias voltage for the load. I need to adjust the AC signal as well, hence my problem.
I'm not able to see the circuit parts -- they are too light for my viewer. Can you post a darker/enhanced version? Thanks.
 
  • #10
Edited.
 
  • #11
I am not sure what it is but I have wondered about the capacitance of LDRs. I too had the same idea long long ago about using them in pi network configuration as a variable attenuator but someone mentioned that their internal capacitance may not be suitable for this. Something to keep in mind.
 
  • #12
I just did a quick reference of an LDR datasheet, It showed a 5pf capacitance. Doesn't seem like enough to affect the frequency response, the mosfet has more gate capacitance.
The problem is LDRs don't have a low enough on resistance.
I'm wondering if I use an extra bright light source I can exceed the datasheet specs.
 
Last edited:
  • #13
coinmaster said:
I just did a quick reference of an LDR datasheet, It showed a 5pf capacitance. Doesn't seem like enough to affect the frequency response, the mosfet has more gate capacitance.
The problem is LDRs don't have a low enough on resistance.
I'm wondering if I use an extra bright light source I can exceed the datasheet specs.
How low do you need to go?
 
  • #14
Optimally, under 1 ohm. Basically as far low as possible.
 
  • #15
Care to explain a little more what you are trying to do? Maybe there is a way for the circuit to be changed? I am curious to know more about this.
 
  • #16
Um, I would love to give you a schematic but this is for a product I've spent countless hours on developing so I'd prefer not to.
I don't think there is another way though, it's a difficult hurdle to get around.
 
  • #17
coinmaster said:
Um, I would love to give you a schematic but this is for a product I've spent countless hours on developing so I'd prefer not to.

ohhh dear, how often we hear that cry :rolleyes::rolleyes:

"I have invented something so wonderful that is going to revolutionise the world"

it's hard for people to help you if you won't let them help by sharing the appropriate infoD
 
  • #18
davenn said:
ohhh dear, how often we hear that cry :rolleyes:
D
I'm sure :-p
 
  • #19
Well that is one of the pains of inventing. Often times there is a case where many people know that 'if it weren't for THIS, then a whole new process for THAT could be implemented'. It is the one guy who overcomes the THIS who stands to gain. So tell me, do you think someone will solve a problem like THIS on an internet forum? Suspecting you are up against such a thing why would anyone even choose to? I recall a number of years ago I was in your situation and asked a question on this forum about whether a specific part exists off the shelf. I got lots of questions and suggestions. I was not in a position to reveal any more information so I just had to live with doing it the hard way and take a chance of reinventing the wheel so to speak. Lesson learned.
 

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