Find the mass of the Sirius system

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around determining the mass of the Sirius system, with a focus on understanding the distance from Earth to Sirius, the concept of parallax, and the interpretation of a graph related to the system's orbit. Participants are exploring the implications of angles measured in degrees and arcseconds, as well as the relationship between distance and angle in astronomical contexts.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants are attempting to calculate the distance to Sirius using the small angle approximation and are questioning the correct interpretation of angles in different units. There is also discussion about the relationship between parallax and parsecs, and how to read a graph related to the Sirius system's orbit.

Discussion Status

The discussion is ongoing, with participants providing insights into the definitions of parallax and parsecs, as well as clarifying the importance of angle units in calculations. Some guidance has been offered regarding the use of tangent functions for small angles, but there is still uncertainty about the graph and its implications.

Contextual Notes

There is a lack of clarity regarding the graph mentioned in the initial post, including what is being plotted and the meaning of the axes. Participants are also navigating the complexities of angle conversions and their relevance to the problem at hand.

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Homework Statement
The trigonometric parallax of sirius (i.e, the angle subtended at sirius by the radius of the earth's orbit) is 0.378 degrees arc. Using this and data in Fig. 3-2, deduce as best you can the mass M of the sirius system in terms of that of the sun, and
a) assuming that the orbital plane is perpendicular to the line of sight, and
b) allowing for the actual tilt of the orbit.
Is your value in part (b) above an upper or lower limit (or either)?
Relevant Equations
...
I'll be focusing on mainly trying to find a way to solve part a, as I don't actually know how to account for the tilt.

When they said degrees arc I assume they're just saying degrees, so I found the distance of Earth to sirius to be around 1.50 x 10^8 km(radius of the earth), because of the small angle subtended.

I also found the period to be around 50+ years, by looking at the graph over the years. After that I'm stuck. In order to find the mass, I still need to know the radius of orbit of sirius, but I don't know how to read the graph to find that.
 

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Ithilrandir said:
I found the distance of Earth to sirius to be around 1.50 x 10^8 km(radius of the earth), because of the small angle subtended.
No, the small angle means it is much further away. Do you understand parallax?
Do you understand what a parsec is?

What is "5hus"?
 
haruspex said:
No, the small angle means it is much further away. Do you understand parallax?
Do you understand what a parsec is?

What is "5hus"?
The 5hus was a typo which I've amended.

My notion of parallax is in this picture.

Are parsec related to the parallax?
 

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Ithilrandir said:
My notion of parallax is in this picture.
Ok, so if b is 1.5x108km and the angle labelled π (terrible choice for a variable name) is 0.378 degrees then what is d?
Ithilrandir said:
Are parsec related to the parallax?
Yes. Look it up.
 
haruspex said:
Ok, so if b is 1.5x108km and the angle labelled π (terrible choice for a variable name) is 0.378 degrees then what is d?

Yes. Look it up.

d = b/tan 0.378.

I've looked up what parsec is. It's the distance from which 1AU subtends at one arc second.
 
Ithilrandir said:
d = b/tan 0.3
Ok, so what is that in km?
By the way, for such small angles you don't need to bother with the tan function. Just write d = b/(angle in radians).
 
haruspex said:
Ok, so what is that in km?
By the way, for such small angles you don't need to bother with the tan function. Just write d = b/(angle in radians).

3.97 x 10^8 km. How does this length relate to the graph in the question?
 
Ithilrandir said:
The trigonometric parallax of sirius (i.e, the angle subtended at sirius by the radius of the Earth's orbit) is 0.378 degrees arc.
No. The trigonometric parallax of Sirius is not 0.378 degrees of arc. It is 0.378 seconds of arc (often abbreviated to ‘arcsec’). That's a big difference.

Also, note that an expression such as ‘tan 0.378’ is meaningless unless you know what unit is being used for the angle. E.g.
tan(0.378 arcsec)
tan (0.378 radians)
tan (0.378º)
are completely different values.

By convention, if we leave out the unit we imply that the angle is in radians. So ‘tan 0.378’ would be interpreted as ‘tan(0.378 radians)’.

As a basic skill, you need to learn/understand how to change arc seconds to degrees and to radians. And you need to ensure that the value of an angle entered into a calculator is being entered in the appropriate unit.

As already noted by @haruspex, for small angles (as in this question), the tangent of the angle is, to a very good approximation, equal to the angle in radians.
E.g. tan(0.00123 rad) = 0.00123
So, for a small angle (value = A radians), it makes negligible difference whether you use tanA or A in calculations.

I am unfamiliar with your diagram in post #1 (Figure 3-2). There is no information about what is being plotted, the meaning of each axis or the meaning of the values around the edge of the ellipse.

[EDITs: Typo's fixed.]
 
Steve4Physics said:
I am unfamiliar with your diagram in post #1 (Figure 3-2). There is no information about what is being plotted, the meaning of each axis or the meaning of the values around the edge of the ellipse.
Thanks for the information in the first half.

The values around the edge are the point where the star is at at that year. As for the rest I don't know either, hence the post. This was all the information I have from the question.
 

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