How to work out the tetrads for given functions?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of tetrads for given functions in the context of general relativity, specifically focusing on the derivatives of these tetrads. Participants explore the mathematical expressions involved and the implications of abstract index notation as presented in Wald's text.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant defines tetrads based on functions of the radial coordinate and seeks clarification on deriving a specific expression involving derivatives.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of understanding that Wald's notation uses abstract indices, indicating that the derivative operators are not limited to a single coordinate direction.
  • A participant explains that the derivative of a scalar function of ##r## points in the direction of increasing ##r##, leading to a specific form of the derivative.
  • There is a query about how to show that a certain term vanishes, prompting a discussion about the nature of coordinate basis vectors being constants.
  • Another participant confirms that the variation in tetrads arises solely from the functions multiplying the basis vectors, leading to the conclusion that certain derivatives vanish.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the nature of the derivative operators and the behavior of the tetrads, but there are nuances in understanding the implications of abstract index notation and the specific calculations involved. The discussion remains somewhat unresolved regarding the exact steps to transition between mathematical expressions.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference Wald's text, indicating a reliance on specific definitions and notation that may not be universally understood. The discussion highlights the need for clarity in mathematical steps and assumptions regarding the nature of derivatives in abstract index notation.

etotheipi
Given functions ##f=f(r)## and ##h = h(r)##, author has defined a tetrad$$(e_0)_a = f^{1/2} (dt)_a, \quad (e_1)_a = h^{1/2}(dr)_a, \quad (e_2)_a = r(d\theta)_a, \quad (e_3)_a = r\sin{\theta} (d\phi)_a$$where ##(t,r,\theta,\phi)## are coordinates. It is required to work out ##\partial_{[a} (e_\mu)_{b]}## for each of these, with ##\partial_a## the normal derivative operator associated with these coordinates. So e.g. for the first one I would have thought$$
\begin{align*}
\partial_{[a} (e_0)_{b]} = \partial_{[a} f^{1/2} (dt)_{b]} = \frac{1}{2}f^{-1/2} (\partial_{[a} f) (dt)_{b]} + f^{1/2} \partial_{[a} (dt)_{b]} \ \ \ (1)
\end{align*}
$$I figured that ##\partial_{\mu} f = \delta_{\mu r} f'##, i.e. zero for ##\mu = t,\theta,\phi## and ##f'## for ##\mu = r##. But solution is$$\partial_{[a} (e_0)_{b]} = \frac{1}{2} f^{-1/2} f' (dr)_{[a} (dt)_{b]} \ \ \ (2)$$How to get from ##(1)## to ##(2)##? Thanks
 
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etotheipi said:
author

Are you referring to a particular textbook or paper? If so, please give a reference.
 
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PeterDonis said:
Are you referring to a particular textbook or paper? If so, please give a reference.

it's chapter 6.1, page 121 of wald
 
etotheipi said:
it's chapter 6.1, page 121 of wald

Ah, ok, I'll take a look.
 
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etotheipi said:
I figured that ##\partial_{\mu} f = \delta_{\mu r} f'##

Remember that Wald's Latin indexes are abstract indexes, i.e., ##\partial_a## is not ##\partial_r## in this case, it's a set of four derivative operators, which in this case are the coordinate derivative operators: ##\partial_t##, ##\partial_r##, ##\partial_\theta##, ##\partial_\phi##. We happen to know that, for the function we are interested in, which is a scalar function of ##r## only, three of these four derivative operators give zero; but Wald is deliberately staying with abstract index notation to make clear what is happening, geometrically: we are taking the derivative of a scalar and the result is a vector.

Now, in what direction does that vector point, when we take the derivative of a scalar function of ##r## only? Obviously, it points in the direction of increasing ##r##. So, if we were just taking the derivative of ##f(r)## by itself, we would have ##\partial_a f(r) = f^\prime(r) \left( dr \right)_a##. The rest is just the chain rule and the extra factor of ##\left( dt \right)_b##.
 
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Ah, I think the ##\partial_a f = f' (dr)_a## part makes sense now. But also, how can we show that the other term ##f^{1/2} \partial_{[a} (dt)_{b]}## vanishes?
 
etotheipi said:
how can we show that the other term ##f^{1/2} \partial_{[a} (dt)_{b]}## vanishes?

All of the vectors ##\left ( dx^\mu \right)_a## are constants, since they're just the coordinate basis vectors. The variation in the tetrads is contained entirely in the functions that multiply them. So all quantities of the form ##\partial_{[a} \left( dx^\mu \right)_{b]}## vanish.
 
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PeterDonis said:
All of the vectors ##\left ( dx^\mu \right)_a## are constants, since they're just the coordinate basis vectors. The variation in the tetrads is contained entirely in the functions that multiply them. So all quantities of the form ##\partial_{[a} \left( dx^\mu \right)_{b]}## vanish.

Nice! Thanks for your help ☺
 
etotheipi said:
Thanks for your help ☺

You're welcome!
 
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  • #10
PeterDonis said:
##\partial_a## is not ##\partial_r## in this case, it's a set of four derivative operators, which in this case are the coordinate derivative operators: ##\partial_t##, ##\partial_r##, ##\partial_\theta##, ##\partial_\phi##.

And to be strictly correct and capture the "which direction does the vector point" issue, we should really write this as:

$$
\partial_a = \left( dt \right)_a \partial_t + \left( dr \right)_a \partial_r + \left( d \theta \right)_a \partial_\theta + \left( d \phi \right)_a \partial_\phi
$$
 
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