Indefinite Integral using Trig Identity i'm confused

Click For Summary

Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the evaluation of the indefinite integral $$\int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4 - x^2}} \, dx$$ using trigonometric substitution. Participants explore the steps involved in the substitution process and the implications of different approaches to the integral.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant describes their approach using the substitution $$x=2\sin u$$ and arrives at the integral $$\int 4\sin^2u \, du$$ but expresses confusion about substituting back to $$u$$.
  • Another participant suggests applying the trigonometric identity $$2\sin^2 u = 1 - \cos 2u$$ to simplify the integral.
  • There is a discussion about the importance of including differentials in the substitution process, with a focus on the variable of integration being $$u$$ rather than $$x$$.
  • Participants clarify that substituting $$u$$ back into the integral without considering the differential leads to incorrect conclusions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree on the need for careful handling of differentials during substitution, but there is no consensus on the best approach to proceed from the integral $$\int 4\sin^2u \, du$$.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the integration variable must be consistent throughout the process, and there are unresolved steps regarding the application of trigonometric identities and the final evaluation of the integral.

Pindrought
Messages
15
Reaction score
0
Okay so I'm working on this problem

$$\int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4 - x^2}} \, dx$$

I do a substitution and set
$$x={\sqrt{4}}sinu$$

I get to this step fine

$$\int 4sin(u)^2$$

I know that u = arcsin(x/2)

so I don't see why I can't just substitute in u into sin(u)?

I tried this and I got
$$\int 4 * arcsin(sin(x/2))^2$$

which worked out to
$$\int 4 * \frac{x^2}{4}$$

which gave me
$$\int x^2$$

which would just mean the answer is
$$\frac{x^3}{3}$$

But looking at the mathhelpboards solver, this is wrong. Can anyone help me figure out what I am not understanding? Thanks a lot for taking the time to read.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
Hint: $2\sin^2 u = 1 - \cos 2u$.
 
Pindrought said:
Okay so I'm working on this problem

$$\int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4 - x^2}} \, dx$$

I do a substitution and set
$$x={\sqrt{4}}sinu$$

I get to this step fine

$$\int 4sin(u)^2$$

I know that u = arcsin(x/2)

so I don't see why I can't just substitute in u into sin(u)?

I tried this and I got
$$\int 4 * arcsin(sin(x/2))^2$$

which worked out to
$$\int 4 * \frac{x^2}{4}$$

which gave me
$$\int x^2$$

which would just mean the answer is
$$\frac{x^3}{3}$$

But looking at the mathhelpboards solver, this is wrong. Can anyone help me figure out what I am not understanding? Thanks a lot for taking the time to read.

The differentials you didn't include in the integrals give us an idea why your approach isn't correct.

What you start with is

\[\int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4-x^2}}\!\color{red}{\,dx}\]

We then make the trig substitution $x=2\sin u\implies \color{red}{\,dx} = 2\cos u \color{blue}{\,du}$

Therefore,

\[\begin{aligned} \int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4-x^2}}\!\color{red}{\,dx} \xrightarrow{x=2\sin u}{} &\phantom{=}\int\frac{4\sin^2u}{2\cos u}\cdot 2\cos u\color{blue}{\,du} \\ &= \int 4\sin^2u\color{blue}{\,du} \end{aligned}\]

If we proceed with how you wanted to do things, if $x=2\sin u \implies u = \arcsin(x/2)$, then

\[\int 4\sin^2u\,du = \int 4\sin^2(\arcsin(x/2))\,du = \int x^2\color{blue}{\,du}\]

We can't say this is $\dfrac{x^3}{3}+C$ because the variable we're integrating with respect to here is $u$, not $x$! If you want to get $\,dx$ instead of $\,du$ in the integral, you are undoing what you just did with your substitution.

Instead, from $\displaystyle \int 4\sin^2u\,du$, you want to apply the trig identity $\sin^2\theta = \dfrac{1-\cos(2\theta)}{2}$ to get
\[\int 4\sin^2u\,du = \int 2-2\cos(2u)\,du\]

Can you take things from here? (Smile)
 
Chris L T521 said:
The differentials you didn't include in the integrals give us an idea why your approach isn't correct.

What you start with is

\[\int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4-x^2}}\!\color{red}{\,dx}\]

We then make the trig substitution $x=2\sin u\implies \color{red}{\,dx} = 2\cos u \color{blue}{\,du}$

Therefore,

\[\begin{aligned} \int \frac{x^2}{\sqrt{4-x^2}}\!\color{red}{\,dx} \xrightarrow{x=2\sin u}{} &\phantom{=}\int\frac{4\sin^2u}{2\cos u}\cdot 2\cos u\color{blue}{\,du} \\ &= \int 4\sin^2u\color{blue}{\,du} \end{aligned}\]

If we proceed with how you wanted to do things, if $x=2\sin u \implies u = \arcsin(x/2)$, then

\[\int 4\sin^2u\,du = \int 4\sin^2(\arcsin(x/2))\,du = \int x^2\color{blue}{\,du}\]

We can't say this is $\dfrac{x^3}{3}+C$ because the variable we're integrating with respect to here is $u$, not $x$! If you want to get $\,dx$ instead of $\,du$ in the integral, you are undoing what you just did with your substitution.

Instead, from $\displaystyle \int 4\sin^2u\,du$, you want to apply the trig identity $\sin^2\theta = \dfrac{1-\cos(2\theta)}{2}$ to get
\[\int 4\sin^2u\,du = \int 2-2\cos(2u)\,du\]

Can you take things from here? (Smile)

Thanks a lot Chris L T521, you really helped me understand what I was doing wrong.
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
3K
  • · Replies 8 ·
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
3K
  • · Replies 1 ·
Replies
1
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K