Intermediate Value Theorem .... Browder, Theorem 3.16 .... ....

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around understanding the proof of Theorem 3.16 from Andrew Browder's book "Mathematical Analysis: An Introduction," specifically focusing on the implications of continuity at a point and the Intermediate Value Theorem (IVT). The scope includes theoretical aspects of continuity, proofs, and related concepts in mathematical analysis.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Peter seeks clarification on demonstrating the existence of a delta such that if \( f(b) > y \), then \( f(t) > y \) for all \( t \) close to \( b \), based on the definition of continuity.
  • One participant expresses frustration with the proof style, suggesting that general topology concepts like connectedness and compactness could imply the theorem more intuitively.
  • This participant proposes using \( \epsilon = f(b) - y > 0 \) to apply the definition of continuity, suggesting a visual approach to understanding the proof.
  • Another participant discusses the connection between the continuity of images of connected sets and the IVT, noting the difficulty in proving that an interval is connected without using least upper bounds.
  • Peter acknowledges the insights and confirms that he has found similar proofs involving least upper bounds in other texts on the IVT.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the clarity and approach to the proof of Theorem 3.16. While some suggest alternative perspectives using topology, others focus on the rigorous application of continuity definitions. No consensus is reached on the best method to understand the proof.

Contextual Notes

The discussion highlights the reliance on definitions and the potential complexity involved in proving connectedness and continuity, particularly in relation to the IVT. There are unresolved assumptions regarding the clarity of the proof and the necessity of using least upper bounds.

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TL;DR
I need help with an aspect of the proof of the Intermediate Value Theorem ...
I am reading Andrew Browder's book: "Mathematical Analysis: An Introduction" ... ...

I am currently reading Chapter 3: Continuous Functions on Intervals and am currently focused on Section 3.1 Limits and Continuity ... ...

I need some help in understanding the proof of Theorem 3.16 ...Theorem 3.16 and its proof read as follows:
Browder - 1 -  Theorem 3.16 ... ... PART 1 ... .png

Browder - 2 -  Theorem 3.16 ... ... PART 2 .png

In the above proof by Andrew Browder we read the following:

" ... ... But ##f(b) \gt y## implies (since ##f## is continuous at ##b##) that there exists ##\delta \gt 0## such that ##f(t) \gt y## for all ##t## with ##b - \delta \lt t \leq b##. ... ... "My question is as follows:

How do we demonstrate explicitly and rigorously that since ##f## is continuous at ##b## and ##f(b) \gt y## therefore we have that there exists ##\delta \gt 0## such that ##f(t) \gt y## for all ##t## with ##b - \delta \lt t \leq b##. ... ...Help will be much appreciated ...

Peter

***NOTE***

The relevant definition of one-sided continuity for the above is as follows:

##f## is continuous from the left at ##b## implies that for every ##\epsilon \gt 0## there exists ##\delta \gt 0## such that for all ##x \in [a, b]## ...

we have that ##b - \delta \lt x \lt b \Longrightarrow \mid f(x) - f(b) \mid \lt \epsilon##
 
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I hate proofs like these. They obscure what's really happening. General topology and the notions of connectedness and compactness immediately imply your theorem.

However, the question you ask is very straightforward to anwer.

Since ##f(b)>y##, we have ##\epsilon:= f(b)-y>0##. Now use the definition of continuity with this choice of ##\epsilon##.

Draw a picture to see how I came up with this choice of ##\epsilon##.
 
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Math_QED said:
I hate proofs like these. They obscure what's really happening. General topology and the notions of connectedness and compactness immediately imply your theorem.

However, the question you ask is very straightforward to anwer.

Since ##f(b)>y##, we have ##\epsilon:= f(b)-y>0##. Now use the definition of continuity with this choice of ##\epsilon##.

Draw a picture to see how I came up with this choice of ##\epsilon##.
Thank you for a most interesting and informative reply ...

Will now look at other proofs to see how concepts of compactness and connectedness imply theorem ...

Will also work on your suggestion ...

Thanks again,

Peter
 
It is of course easy to prove that the continuous image of a connected set is connected, but I think it is not so easy to prove an interval is connected without essentially the same argument using least upper bounds; indeed that fact is essentially equivalent to the intermediate value theorem. One of my favorite definitions of connectedness is that a set S is connected iff every continuous map S-->{0,1} is constant, where {0,1} is the two point set containing only 0 and 1. It is easy to show this special case is equivalent to the full intermediate value theorem. So I could be wrong but I am afraid you are stuck with some such proof using sups. i.e. least upper bounds.
 
Thanks for a very interesting post, mathwonk ...

Indeed, having consulted several texts on the IVT I have found, as you predict, that the proof involves sups in each case ...

Thanks again ...

Peter
 

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