Laws Of Thermodynamics (Pre-university)

  • Context: Graduate 
  • Thread starter Thread starter saubhik
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Laws Thermodynamics
Click For Summary
SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the First and Second Laws of Thermodynamics, specifically addressing the equation U = Q - W, which defines the change in internal energy (U) of a gas when heat (Q) is added and work (W) is done by the gas. Participants clarify that "systematic motion" refers to the translational or rotational movement of the gas and its container, emphasizing that the First Law applies primarily to systems at rest. The conversation also explores the Kelvin-Planck statement, which asserts that no heat engine can convert heat from a single temperature source entirely into work without additional effects, highlighting the necessity of cyclic processes to prevent total entropy decrease.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of the First Law of Thermodynamics (U = Q - W)
  • Familiarity with the Second Law of Thermodynamics and entropy concepts
  • Knowledge of heat engines and cyclic processes
  • Basic principles of thermodynamic systems and energy conservation
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the implications of the Kelvin-Planck statement in thermodynamic cycles
  • Study the relationship between heat transfer and entropy in thermodynamic processes
  • Explore non-cyclic thermodynamic processes and their limitations
  • Investigate real-world applications of the First and Second Laws of Thermodynamics in engineering
USEFUL FOR

Students and educators in physics, engineers designing thermal systems, and anyone interested in the principles of thermodynamics and their applications in real-world scenarios.

saubhik
Messages
30
Reaction score
0
Suppose, in a thermodynamic process, an amount Q of heat is given to the gas and an amount W of work is done by it. The total energy of the gas must increase by Q-W. As a result, the entire gas together with its container may start moving (systematic motion) or the internal energy (random motion of the molecules) of the gas may increase. If the energy doesn't appear as a systematic motion of the gas then this net energy Q-W must go in the form of its internal energy ( denoted by U ). Thus we get:
U = Q - W​
The above equation is the statement of the 1st Law of thermodynamics.


Now, I am not clear about the systematic motion part. First of all, what does 'systematic motion' really mean? I mean, what if energy appears as systematic motion ? does it not then follow 1st Law of Thermodynamics? Isn't The 1st Law true for every process in universe? (even though it is derived assuming gas-container system does not have any systematic motion!) Can anyone please clarify this? (thanks)

My 2nd question is : Is there any engine which does not work in cyclic process?
According to Kelvin-Planck Statement: "It is not possible to design a heat engine which works in a cyclic process and whose only result is to take heat from a body at a single temperature and convert it completely into mechanical work."
1.Why does this statement not hold for any non-cyclic process?
2.What is the exact meaning of the phrase "single temperature" in the statement?
3.Can anybody tell me why the Kelvin-Plank statement is true? (I mean is there any proof for 2nd Law or any physical explanation?)
4. Another form of the 2nd Law is " It is not possible to have a process in which entropy of an isolated system is decreased. " I am unable to relate this form with the Kelvin-Plank statement. Also can anyone explain why entropy cannot be decreased? (may be a foolish question but still can't find a satisfactory explanation!:frown:)


Any replies would be highly appreciated. Thank you!
 
Science news on Phys.org
Hi saubhik, welcome to PF!

saubhik said:
Now, I am not clear about the systematic motion part. First of all, what does 'systematic motion' really mean? I mean, what if energy appears as systematic motion ? does it not then follow 1st Law of Thermodynamics? Isn't The 1st Law true for every process in universe? (even though it is derived assuming gas-container system does not have any systematic motion!) Can anyone please clarify this? (thanks)

"Systematic motion" means that the container and the gas are translating and/or rotating. The First Law is generally applied to bodies at rest. In this sense, it isn't as broad as the law of energy conservation, which does apply to all processes in the universe.

saubhik said:
My 2nd question is : Is there any engine which does not work in cyclic process?
According to Kelvin-Planck Statement: "It is not possible to design a heat engine which works in a cyclic process and whose only result is to take heat from a body at a single temperature and convert it completely into mechanical work."
1.Why does this statement not hold for any non-cyclic process?
2.What is the exact meaning of the phrase "single temperature" in the statement?
3.Can anybody tell me why the Kelvin-Plank statement is true? (I mean is there any proof for 2nd Law or any physical explanation?)
4. Another form of the 2nd Law is " It is not possible to have a process in which entropy of an isolated system is decreased. " I am unable to relate this form with the Kelvin-Plank statement. Also can anyone explain why entropy cannot be decreased? (may be a foolish question but still can't find a satisfactory explanation!:frown:)


The reason cyclic processes come into play is that, most fundamentally, total entropy in the universe tends to increase. Also, heat transfer carries entropy, while (reversible) work doesn't. Therefore, you can't have a process that takes in heat (thermal energy), provides work, and returns to its starting position (i.e., completes a cycle), because it would consistently decrease the total entropy in the universe.

It's no problem to take in heat and convert the energy to produce work; you could do that by boiling water and using the steam pressure to push a piston. But that only works once; now the water has changed to steam. To get back to water (i.e., to complete the cycle), you have to condense the steam, which releases heat. Thus, you're not able to completely convert heat to work if you wish to run the cycle repeatedly.

Does this start to answer your questions?
 

Similar threads

  • · Replies 46 ·
2
Replies
46
Views
7K
  • · Replies 4 ·
Replies
4
Views
2K
  • · Replies 33 ·
2
Replies
33
Views
3K
  • · Replies 60 ·
3
Replies
60
Views
11K
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
3K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
2K
  • · Replies 12 ·
Replies
12
Views
3K
  • · Replies 22 ·
Replies
22
Views
6K
  • · Replies 14 ·
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • · Replies 5 ·
Replies
5
Views
3K