Levels of Civilization Based on Deuterium

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SUMMARY

The discussion centers on the concept of establishing a hierarchy of civilizations based on deuterium access and its potential for fusion energy. Participants agree that controlled fusion of deuterium is not currently achievable, with existing fusion reactors primarily utilizing tritium and deuterium. Christopher Barnatt's insights on helium-3 and nuclear fusion highlight the complexities of using deuterium as a fuel source. The conversation emphasizes the need for practical metrics, such as total electricity generation per capita, rather than solely focusing on deuterium cultivation.

PREREQUISITES
  • Understanding of nuclear fusion processes, specifically deuterium and tritium reactions.
  • Familiarity with the Kardashev Scale and its application to civilization hierarchies.
  • Knowledge of current nuclear fusion reactor technologies and their fuel sources.
  • Awareness of isotopes, particularly deuterium and helium-3, and their roles in energy production.
NEXT STEPS
  • Research the current state of controlled fusion technology and its limitations.
  • Explore the implications of using helium-3 in nuclear fusion and its potential advantages.
  • Investigate alternative energy generation methods that may surpass fusion in the future.
  • Examine metrics for measuring civilization energy production, such as total electricity generation per capita.
USEFUL FOR

This discussion is beneficial for physicists, energy researchers, science fiction writers, and anyone interested in the future of energy production and civilization development based on advanced technologies.

hyperiontorus
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Summary:: Similar to the Kardashev Scale, create a means for forming a hierarchy of civilization based on deuterium access.

I'm interested in the fusion process using deuterium, and I've noted that it remains (to this day) the greatest source of energy of any reactions. Because of this reason, I want to evaluate how to create a hierarchy of civilizations based on deuterium cultivation. Is it possible to base a hierarchy of civilizations based on accumulation or fusions of cultivated deuterium?
 
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hyperiontorus said:
I'm interested in the fusion process using deuterium, and I've noted that it remains (to this day) the greatest source of energy of any reactions. Because of this reason, I want to evaluate how to create a hierarchy of civilizations based on deuterium cultivation. Is it possible to base a hierarchy of civilizations based on accumulation or fusions of cultivated deuterium?
No, it isn´ t.

To this day, we cannot have controlled fusion of deuterium.
If someone did have a "handwave" way of controlled fusion, protium would be much more abundant than deuterium.
It is plausible to have a device that can usably fuse deuterium but not protium. But we do not have such a device this day.
 
snorkack said:
No, it isn´ t.

To this day, we cannot have controlled fusion of deuterium.
If someone did have a "handwave" way of controlled fusion, protium would be much more abundant than deuterium.
It is plausible to have a device that can usably fuse deuterium but not protium. But we do not have such a device this day.

Interesting. I'm basing my orders of civilization upon deuterium because it provides a middle-ground of fusion between hyrdrogen+1 and helium+2. According to Christopher Barnatt here: https://explainingthefuture.com/helium3.html, in the section topic titled, "Helium-3 and Nuclear Fusion," "In current nuclear fusion reactors, the hydrogen isotopes tritium and deuterium are used as the fuel, with atomic energy released when their nuclei fuse to create helium and a neutron."

Also, this article discusses a new patent for such a "device" that can fuse deuterium and tritium: https://marketmadhouse.com/is-the-us-navy-trying-to-patent-a-fusion-reactor/#:~:text=Theoretically%2C%20the%20device%20could%20achieve%20thermonuclear%20fusion%20by,device%20could%20generate%20one%20trillion%20watts%20of%20power
 
Last edited:
hyperiontorus said:
In current nuclear fusion reactors, the hydrogen isotopes tritium and deuterium are used as the fuel
That is generally false. Most of them use helium, regular hydrogen and/or deuterium. The reactors focus on studying the plasma, which you can do without tritium. Adding tritium makes the reactor vessel radioactive, so maintenance becomes much more difficult. The studies are done with a potential future D-T fusion reactor in mind, sure. But very few reactors actually use tritium.

He-3 plus deuterium is not aneutronic as the D-D reaction produces neutrons.
hyperiontorus said:
Because of this reason, I want to evaluate how to create a hierarchy of civilizations based on deuterium cultivation. Is it possible to base a hierarchy of civilizations based on accumulation or fusions of cultivated deuterium?
No one stops you from making up categories, just don't expect others to use these categories.
 
hyperiontorus said:
I want to evaluate how to create a hierarchy of civilizations based on deuterium cultivation.
kg/capita/year?

Deuterium is a thing which actually has a bunch of uses. I think your fiction would need to be based on what those fictional civilisations used the deuterium for. If it's for energy production, why not just go on the amount of energy it is used to generate, rather than the input material?
 
It's a bit of a specific thing to measure, right? Basically through modern day we cultivate no deuterium for fusion energy. In a hundred years we might have a better method of energy creation than fusion that involves deuterium.

Total electricity generation per person or something like that seems straightforward and more flexible.
 

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