Linear coefficient of thermal expansion

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the definition and implications of the coefficient of linear thermal expansion (k), particularly in relation to its approximation and the accuracy of its application in calculating changes in length due to temperature variations. Participants explore the mathematical relationships involved and the potential limitations of using a single constant for thermal expansion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether the relationship ##\Delta L=Lk\Delta T## is merely an approximation, suggesting that reversing the temperature change does not return the material to its original length.
  • Another participant notes that the coefficient of linear expansion is temperature dependent and that this dependence is often negligible until materials reach their melting or decomposition points.
  • A participant emphasizes that the approximation holds true when treating the changes as finite, referencing the traditional interpretation of the symbols used.
  • There is a mention of the Wikipedia article's use of derivative notation for the coefficient of linear expansion, which some participants find more precise than the traditional finite change notation.
  • One participant acknowledges the insight of expressing the relationship differentially, indicating a recognition of the nuances in the definition of k.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the accuracy and applicability of the coefficient of linear expansion, with some supporting the traditional definition while others advocate for a more precise differential approach. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the best way to define and apply the coefficient.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include the dependence of the coefficient on temperature and the potential inaccuracies when using finite changes in length and temperature. The discussion highlights the need for careful consideration of these factors in practical applications.

Nathanael
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The "coefficient of linear expansion" (≡k) was defined in my book by the following relationship:
##\Delta L=Lk\Delta T##
Where L is length and T is temperature

I'm wondering, is this just an approximation? Because, if you were to increase the temperature by \Delta T and then calculate the new length, and then decrease the temperature by the same \Delta T and calculate the new length again, you would not get back to your original length.

Wouldn't the "symmetrical" definition of k be
##L_{f}=L_{0}e^{k\Delta T}##

This leads me to the question:
Is the reason they don't define it like this because the idea of 'linear thermal expansion' is not true to that degree of accuracy?
(In other words, finding the new length (to that accuracy) is not as simple as using a single constant?)
 
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Nathanael said:
not as simple as using a single constant?
It's temperature dependent, and generally so small that the dependence isn't measureable before things melt/decompose.
 
Nathanael said:
The "coefficient of linear expansion" (≡k) was defined in my book by the following relationship:
##\Delta L=Lk\Delta T##

That's only an approximation if we treat the \Delta's as finite, which is the traditional interpretation of \Delta's.

I notice the Wikipedia article defines the coefficient of linear expansion using the notation for derivatives. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_expansion
 
Stephen Tashi said:
That's only an approximation if we treat the \Delta's as finite, which is the traditional interpretation of \Delta's.

I notice the Wikipedia article defines the coefficient of linear expansion using the notation for derivatives. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thermal_expansion

Thanks, I didn't see that. Everywhere I looked kept using \Delta L and \Delta T. Next time I'll be sure to check Wikipedia.
 
I think it was very perceptive of you to intuitively realize that it should, more precisely, be expressed differentially.

Chet
 
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