Phasor Mesh Current-what am I doing wrong?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculation of phasor mesh currents in a circuit, focusing on the application of mesh current analysis using phasors and complex numbers. Participants are attempting to identify potential errors in the setup and solution of the equations derived from the circuit diagram.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • The original poster presents their equations for mesh currents I1 and I2 but expresses confusion over why their answers are marked incorrect.
  • One participant questions how the 600V at -30 degrees was incorporated into the equations, suggesting that this detail is crucial for identifying any mistakes.
  • Another participant suggests checking the signs of the mutual inductance terms, emphasizing the importance of dot notation and loop current directions.
  • The original poster responds by stating that they have incorporated the 600V correctly and describes their method of using a calculator for the transformations.
  • There is a discussion about the polarity marks for the j24Ω term, with the original poster indicating uncertainty about how to handle them, despite trying various combinations.
  • One participant reassures the original poster that their mutual inductance polarities appear correct and discusses the relationship between current direction and induced voltage polarity.
  • Another participant critiques the second mesh equation, stating that it is not a viable equation and emphasizes the need to transform the voltage source into the same format used for other components.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the correctness of the equations and the handling of the voltage source. There is no consensus on the source of the error, and multiple perspectives on the approach to the problem remain unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants note potential issues with the transformation of the voltage source and the handling of mutual inductance terms, but these aspects remain unclear and unresolved in the discussion.

teh_dude
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Phasor Mesh Current--what am I doing wrong??

Homework Statement


Circuit diagram:
meshphasor.jpg

Calculate the phasor mesh currents, I1 and I2.

Homework Equations


KVL/Mesh Current analysis with phasors/complex numbers.

The Attempt at a Solution



Mesh 1: (-550@0deg) + j75(I1) + 30(I1 - I2) - j40(I1) - j24(I2) = 0

Mesh 2: (600@-30deg) + 30(I2 - I1) + j50(I2) + 80(I2) - j24(I1) = 0

(30 + j35)I1 - (30 + j24)I2 = 550
-(30 + j24)I1 + (110 + j50)I2 = (-600@-30deg)

I got:

I1 = (9.45503221553 @ -38.8333374187 degrees) A

I2 = (2.79176352576 @ 93.1719060416 degrees) A

This problem was even demonstrated in class. Yet the homework site keeps telling me I'm wrong. I don't see where I've made a mistake...?
 
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How did you incorporate the 600V at -30 degrees in your equations? You didn't show us that, so we can't find your mistake for you, if there is one.
 


Maybe check that the signs of the mutual inductance terms respect the dot notation and choice of loop current directions?
 


rude man said:
How did you incorporate the 600V at -30 degrees in your equations? You didn't show us that, so we can't find your mistake for you, if there is one.

Mesh 2: (600@-30deg) + 30(I2 - I1) + j50(I2) + 80(I2) - j24(I1) = 0

How else can I demonstrate? It's there.

If you mean how did I mix polar notation with rectangular notation, I punched it all into the TI-89, in which the modes were set to degree, polar, and approximate.

Otherwise, I don't know what you're getting at.
 
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gneill said:
Maybe check that the signs of the mutual inductance terms respect the dot notation and choice of loop current directions?

I don't entirely understand how to deal with the polarity marks, but I've tried switching plus and minus for the j24Ω term. It's my understanding that they should both be -j24Ω, multiplied by I1 or I2 respectively, but I've tried both minus, both plus, one minus, one plus, the other way around, and none of the answers are correct.
 


teh_dude said:
I don't entirely understand how to deal with the polarity marks, but I've tried switching plus and minus for the j24Ω term. It's my understanding that they should both be -j24Ω, multiplied by I1 or I2 respectively, but I've tried both minus, both plus, one minus, one plus, the other way around, and none of the answers are correct.

I've taken a closer look at your circuit and I believe that you have them correctly oriented. Sorry for the bother.

The idea is that a positively increasing current flowing into one coil at its dot produces a positive polarity of induced voltage at the dot of the second coil. So you have to be attentive as to whether a positive increase in the mesh current will create a positive increase in the current flowing into the coil dot, or whether it will in fact cause a decrease.

attachment.php?attachmentid=41401&stc=1&d=1322725464.jpg
 

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teh_dude said:
Mesh 2: (600@-30deg) + 30(I2 - I1) + j50(I2) + 80(I2) - j24(I1) = 0

How else can I demonstrate? It's there.

If you mean how did I mix polar notation with rectangular notation, I punched it all into the TI-89, in which the modes were set to degree, polar, and approximate.

Otherwise, I don't know what you're getting at.

That is not a viable equation. You must transform the "600V@-30deg" the same way you transform components. Example: you didn't write "wL@+90deg" for the inductive impedance, did you? You wrorte jwL. jwL is the transform of wL@+90deg. Do the same for the 600V@-30 deg. I don't know what your TI-59 is doing & I can't guess.

I checked & your mutual inductance polarities are correct and in fact your equations are correct, except the second equation is not an equation. :frown:
 
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