Proving A_4 ≠ S_4: Is Order of Elements Enough?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around the isomorphism between the alternating group A_4 and the symmetric group S_4, as well as a mention of the dihedral group D_6. Participants are exploring the properties of group isomorphisms and the implications of element orders in these groups.

Discussion Character

  • Conceptual clarification, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the significance of element orders in determining isomorphism, with one questioning whether differing orders are sufficient for a rigorous conclusion. Others clarify that isomorphisms require a 1-1 correspondence and preservation of element orders.

Discussion Status

The conversation is active, with participants providing insights into group theory concepts. There is a recognition of the importance of demonstrating differences in element orders to establish non-isomorphism, and some participants are considering applying these arguments to different groups.

Contextual Notes

There is a correction regarding the original question, shifting focus from A_4 and S_4 to A_4 and D_6, which may influence the discussion's direction and the relevance of previously mentioned arguments.

latentcorpse
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How do I go about showing [itex]A_4 \not\cong S_4[/itex]

So far the only argument I've been able to come up with is that the order of the elements of the two groups differ. Is this sufficient to conclude the two groups aren't isomorphic - it just doesn't seem that rigorous to me.
 
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A group isomorphism is a 1-1 and onto mapping between two groups. Of course that implies they have the same order. There's nothing nonrigorous about saying that.
 
If [tex]\phi[/tex] is an isomorphism between groups then [tex]\phi(g^n) = \phi(g)^n[/tex] so [tex]\phi[/tex] must preserve orders. If you can demonstrate there is an element in one group with an order which doesn't appear in the other group then that means there can be no isomorphism.
 
my bad,
the question was to show A4 isn't isomorphic to D6.
surely i can just apply the argument given in post 3 to this case though?
 
latentcorpse said:
my bad,
the question was to show A4 isn't isomorphic to D6.
surely i can just apply the argument given in post 3 to this case though?

Absolutely.
 

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