Resistance equivalent to a circuit

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the total resistance in a circuit from point A to point B (ground) using nodal analysis results. Participants explore the implications of voltage values at various nodes and the effects of shorted resistors in the circuit. The context includes a practical application related to building an artificial Hex player.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning

Main Points Raised

  • One participant inquires about using nodal analysis results to determine total resistance from point A to point B.
  • Another participant asserts that the voltages at nodes V1 and V2 must be the same due to their connection by a wire.
  • It is noted that the voltages at nodes V3 and V4 must be zero since they are connected to ground.
  • A participant suggests that the resistance from A to B is equal to the voltages at V1 and V2, given a current source of 1 amp.
  • There is a question about why V1 and V2 would have the same voltage if current can flow into them, raising concerns about their potential relative to point A.
  • Another participant emphasizes that shorted resistors can be replaced by wires, leaving only three resistors in parallel in the circuit.
  • Clarification is provided that real wires have some resistance, but in circuit analysis, they are often treated as having zero resistance unless specified otherwise.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the implications of voltage values at nodes V1 and V2, particularly regarding their potential relative to point A. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact interpretation of these voltage relationships and their impact on resistance calculations.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge the circuit's variable nature, suggesting that the analysis may not apply universally to more complex circuits. There is also mention of the limitations of treating wires as having zero resistance without accounting for their actual properties.

oswald2323
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Hi,

Suppose I have the following circuit (excuse the ugly drawing):
fm6m14.png


Suppose the generator is 1A and all the resistance are 1 Ohm (the values are not important). Moreover, suppose I already have all the voltages in V1, V2, V3, V4 (which I got using nodal analysis), and V0 is set to ground (V0 = 0).

How do I get the total resistance from point A to point B (or node V0)? Can I use the results I got from nodal analysis for this?


Please note my knowledge of electrical circuits is very basic, as this is not my field. I am using this to build an artificial Hex player, and resistance provides a good connectivity measure from each side of the board (see page 2 in http://home.earthlink.net/~vanshel/VAnshelevich-01.pdf).
 
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The voltages of V1 and V2 must be the same since they are connected by a wire.

The voltages of V3 and V4 must be zero since they are connected together by a wire which is also connected to ground.

For this circuit, since you are exciting it with a current source of 1 amp, then the resistance from A to B (ground) is equal to the voltages at V1 and V2, which are the same.
 
Any resistors you have shorted out can be replaced by wires.

That only leaves 3 resistors in parallel in the middle of the diagram.

They are all 1 ohm, so ... what is the total resistance?
 
The Electrician said:
The voltages of V1 and V2 must be the same since they are connected by a wire.

The voltages of V3 and V4 must be zero since they are connected together by a wire which is also connected to ground.

For this circuit, since you are exciting it with a current source of 1 amp, then the resistance from A to B (ground) is equal to the voltages at V1 and V2, which are the same.

Are you saying that the resistance from A to B is R = V1/I = V1 Ohm = V2 Ohm?

Also, why is the voltage the same in V1 and V2, if current can flow from A to V1 and V2? Shouldn't V1 and V2 have a lower potential than A?

@vk6kro: I wanted to avoid that kind of analysis, since this circuit is not "fixed". Its just the simplest case of a much larger circuit that may look different (resistances with value=+infinite or 0), and I want a way to solve this that is easy to code into a program that does it (an algorithm, so to speak).

Thanks!
 
oswald2323 said:
Are you saying that the resistance from A to B is R = V1/I = V1 Ohm = V2 Ohm?

Exactly.

oswald2323 said:
Also, why is the voltage the same in V1 and V2, if current can flow from A to V1 and V2? Shouldn't V1 and V2 have a lower potential than A?Thanks!

The voltage is the same at V1 and V2 because they are connected together by a wire.

In schematics such as you have shown, a simple line represents a wire, which is assumed to have zero resistance.

Real wires don't have zero resistance. They have some finite, non-zero resistance, but if you want to treat that in a circuit you would usually insert a resistor symbol of some low value like 500 microhms to represent the wire resistance. In the absence of any such representation of the non-zero resistance of a wire, the wire is treated as though it has zero resistance.
 

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