Solve Dropped Samovar Problem w/ Physics HW

  • Thread starter Thread starter icurryx3
  • Start date Start date
  • Tags Tags
    Physics
Click For Summary

Homework Help Overview

The problem involves a Russian balloonist who drops a samovar from an altitude of 120 meters while ascending at a constant speed of 1.5 m/s. The goal is to determine the height of the balloon when the samovar reaches the ground, which introduces concepts from kinematics and free fall.

Discussion Character

  • Mixed

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the setup of the problem using kinematic equations, questioning how to assign variables for initial velocity, acceleration, displacement, and time. There is exploration of the simultaneous motion of the samovar falling and the balloon rising.

Discussion Status

Participants have shared various interpretations of the problem and attempted to clarify the roles of different variables. Some have provided guidance on how to approach the calculations, while others express confusion about the correct setup and calculations. There is ongoing exploration of the implications of the balloon's motion and the effects of gravity.

Contextual Notes

There are mentions of potential missing information and the need for careful reading of the problem statement. Participants are also considering the effects of rounding in their calculations, which may influence the final answer.

icurryx3
Messages
19
Reaction score
1

Homework Statement


A Russian balloonist floating at an altitude of 120 meters accidentally drops his samovar and starts to ascend at the constant speed of 1.5 m/s. How high will the balloon be when the samovar reaches the ground?

Homework Equations


D = V0T + 1/2(A)(t)^2
V = V0 + AT
V^2 = V0^2 + 2ad

The Attempt at a Solution


I tried to use V0, V, A, D, T, to set up the problem but I'm not quite sure which variable fits where.
 
Physics news on Phys.org
For the falling samovar, V0 is 0, and A is -9.8 m/s^2. It will "hit the ground" when D= -120 since you are taking D= 0 at 120 ft.
Put those numbers into your equation and solve for t.

For the balloon, V0 is 3/2= 1.5 m/s and A is 0. Find D when t is the value you got above. Don't forget to add 120 ft to get the actual height above the ground.
 
icurryx3 said:

Homework Statement


A Russian balloonist floating at an altitude of 120 meters accidentally drops his samovar and starts to ascend at the constant speed of 1.5 m/s. How high will the balloon be when the samovar reaches the ground?

Homework Equations


D = V0T + 1/2(A)(t)^2
V = V0 + AT
V^2 = V0^2 + 2ad

The Attempt at a Solution


I tried to use V0, V, A, D, T, to set up the problem but I'm not quite sure which variable fits where.
You've got two independent things going on simultaneously:
1. The samovar falls out of the balloon.
2. The balloon starts rising at constant velocity, after the samovar falls out.

You want to find the altitude of the balloon when the samovar hits the ground.

Start by asking:

1. How long does it take the samovar to fall 120 meters?
 
SteamKing said:
You've got two independent things going on simultaneously:
1. The samovar falls out of the balloon.
2. The balloon starts rising at constant velocity, after the samovar falls out.

You want to find the altitude of the balloon when the samovar hits the ground.

Start by asking:

1. How long does it take the samovar to fall 120 meters?
To find that, I would need to find other key facts about the problem. How can I go about doing this?
 
icurryx3 said:
To find that, I would need to find other key facts about the problem. How can I go about doing this?
What key facts are you missing? I thought the problem statement gave sufficient information to find a solution.
 
SteamKing said:
What key facts are you missing? I thought the problem statement gave sufficient information to find a solution.
That's the problem..
I'm having trouble putting the given factors into V0, V, A, D, T.
For instance:
V0=
V=1.5m/s^2
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=120m
T=
 
Would this be correct or am I doing it incorrectly?
 
icurryx3 said:
Would this be correct or am I doing it incorrectly?

icurryx3 said:
That's the problem..
I'm having trouble putting the given factors into V0, V, A, D, T.
For instance:
V0=
V=1.5m/s^2
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=120m
T=
You didn't read what I wrote in Post #3.

The samovar is falling to the ground independently of what the balloon is doing. Calculate how long it takes the samovar to fall 120 meters.

Remember, the balloon doesn't start to rise until after the samovar falls. So what is the initial velocity of the samovar at the start of its fall?
 
SteamKing said:
You didn't read what I wrote in Post #3.

The samovar is falling to the ground independently of what the balloon is doing. Calculate how long it takes the samovar to fall 120 meters.

Remember, the balloon doesn't start to rise until after the samovar falls. So what is the initial velocity of the samovar at the start of its fall?
Ah, so the set-up would be:
V0=0
V=
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=120m
T=?
I think it would be -120m since the displacement of the samovar changed negatively with the downfall, am I correct? And using this would help me solve for the time?
 
  • #10
icurryx3 said:
Ah, so the set-up would be:
V0=0
V=
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=120m
T=?
I think it would be -120m since the displacement of the samovar changed negatively with the downfall, am I correct? And using this would help me solve for the time?
Yes, with the proper SUVAT formula.
 
  • #11
SteamKing said:
Yes, with the proper SUVAT formula.
So now, I have the following information for the drop:
V0=0
V=-48.5m/s
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=-120m
T=4.9s
What should my next step be?
 
  • #12
icurryx3 said:
So now, I have the following information for the drop:
V0=0
V=-48.5m/s
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=-120m
T=4.9s
What should my next step be?
Now that you know the time it takes the samovar to fall, how about reading the problem statement again and see if you can complete the solution?
 
  • #13
SteamKing said:
Now that you know the time it takes the samovar to fall, how about reading the problem statement again and see if you can complete the solution?
For some reason, I am getting the wrong answer..
Here is what I set-up for the height:
V0=1.5m/s
V=
A=-9.81m/s^2
D=?
T=4.9s
 
  • #14
HallsofIvy said:
For the falling samovar, V0 is 0, and A is -9.8 m/s^2. It will "hit the ground" when D= -120 since you are taking D= 0 at 120 ft.
Put those numbers into your equation and solve for t.

For the balloon, V0 is 3/2= 1.5 m/s and A is 0. Find D when t is the value you got above. Don't forget to add 120 ft to get the actual height above the ground.
Why is A = 0? Isn't gravity acting down on the balloon?
 
  • #15
icurryx3 said:
Why is A = 0? Isn't gravity acting down on the balloon?
The balloon isn't falling; it's a balloon! Balloons float in the air because they have a lower average density than the air displaced by the balloon.

When the samovar falls out, the balloon suddenly gets lighter and starts to rise, as astounding as that may seem.
 
  • #16
SteamKing said:
The balloon isn't falling; it's a balloon! Balloons float in the air because they have a lower average density than the air displaced by the balloon.

When the samovar falls out, the balloon suddenly gets lighter and starts to rise, as astounding as that may seem.
Alright but I don't seem to be getting the correct answer despite the V0vadt.
Have I done a mistake?
 
  • #17
icurryx3 said:

Homework Statement


A Russian balloonist floating at an altitude of 120 meters accidentally drops his samovar and starts to ascend at the constant speed of 1.5 m/s. How high will the balloon be when the samovar reaches the ground?

An important part of solving any problem is reading the problem statement carefully.

icurryx3 said:
Alright but I don't seem to be getting the correct answer despite the V0vadt.
Have I done a mistake?

What's V0vadt? Show your calculations.
 
  • #18
I was taught V0VADT which corresponds to your SUVAT formula.
As of now, my formula is the following:
Vo=1.5m/s
V=
A=0
D=?
T=4.9s
 
  • #19
icurryx3 said:
I was taught V0VADT which corresponds to your SUVAT formula.
As of now, my formula is the following:
Vo=1.5m/s
V=
A=0
D=?
T=4.9s
That's not a formula. It's a list of numbers, incomplete.

If the balloon rises at 1.5 m/s for 4.9 s, how far does it rise?

The questions don't get any easier than this, except the one which asks you to write your name on the paper.
 
  • #20
SteamKing said:
That's not a formula. It's a list of numbers, incomplete.

If the balloon rises at 1.5 m/s for 4.9 s, how far does it rise?

The questions don't get any easier than this, except the one which asks you to write your name on the paper.
Alright so for that, I'll use d=vt.
So the balloon rises 7.35m and if I were to add that to 120m, it would give me 127.35m however, the answer given to me by the teacher indicates that it should be 128m. The thing is, I got 127.35m a while ago but just because it was not exactly 128m, I kept repeating my steps.
 
  • #21
icurryx3 said:
Alright so for that, I'll use d=vt.
So the balloon rises 7.35m and if I were to add that to 120m, it would give me 127.35m however, the answer given to me by the teacher indicates that it should be 128m. The thing is, I got 127.35m a while ago but just because it was not exactly 128m, I kept repeating my steps.
Round-off in an extended calculation can get tricky to handle. For instance, in calculating the falling time of the samovar, did you get 4.9 seconds exactly, or were there more decimal places?

As far as 128 m is concerned, that could be anything from 127.50 m to 128.49 m.

Some things you'll have to let your teachers decide; that's part of their job. Just make sure that your calculations are laid out in an orderly fashion for him or her to review.
 
  • #22
SteamKing said:
Round-off in an extended calculation can get tricky to handle. For instance, in calculating the falling time of the samovar, did you get 4.9 seconds exactly, or were there more decimal places?

As far as 128 m is concerned, that could be anything from 127.50 m to 128.49 m.

Some things you'll have to let your teachers decide; that's part of their job. Just make sure that your calculations are laid out in an orderly fashion for him or her to review.
Alright. And I probably rounded the 4.9 seconds like you stated.
Thank you for the help!
 

Similar threads

A stone is dropped from an ascending balloon...
  • · Replies 10 ·
Replies
10
Views
1K
I need opinions on a Projectile Motion problem that I made up
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
Can You Solve These Physics Puzzles Before Tomorrow's Deadline?
  • · Replies 6 ·
Replies
6
Views
4K
Linear Motion Formulas for an Inclined Plane
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
Kinematic Equation Problem using Velocity & Distance
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
2K
A ball rolls on a horizontal table and drops. it hits the 0.
  • · Replies 13 ·
Replies
13
Views
2K
Vfx: 12m/sVfy: -9.81m/sRubber Duckie Drop Homework
  • · Replies 11 ·
Replies
11
Views
2K
Are the 2nd and 3rd problems in this video correctly solved? (charged dipole and organ pipe problems)
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
1K
What is the Correct Acceleration of the Rocket During Its Launch Phase?
  • · Replies 3 ·
Replies
3
Views
3K
Rotational Energy and Linear Momentum Problem
  • · Replies 2 ·
Replies
2
Views
3K