Solving higher order ODE as system of first order

gfd43tg
Gold Member
Messages
947
Reaction score
48
For this problem, I am stuck on the actual system. I don't see what substitution I can make, and the fact that ##u(v)## is a piece-wise function is tripping me up. How the heck do I approach this?? This doesn't look like a standard problem at all.
 

Attachments

  • ImageUploadedByPhysics Forums1407818698.322480.jpg
    ImageUploadedByPhysics Forums1407818698.322480.jpg
    22.8 KB · Views: 490
Physics news on Phys.org
Actually, that's very much a standard problem- except perhaps that the function on the right, u, is much simpler than usual- it only has two values. No, you do not let "v=\theta" First, it isn't the independent variable you want to change to reduce the order and second, setting one variable equal to a new variable is just changing its name- not really changing anything.

Instead, let the new variable be equal to the derivative of \theta: \phi= d\theta/dt so that the second derivative of \theta is the first derivative of \phi- d^2\theta/dt^2= d\phi/dt. Now what does d^2\theta/dt^2= v(\theta) become?
 
okay,
Are these two my new system of two first order equations? They don't have to be derivatives with respect to the same variable?
\phi = \frac{d{\theta}}{dt}
\frac{d^2{\theta}}{dt^2} = \frac{d{\phi}}{dt}

Therefore,
\frac{d^2{\theta}}{dt^2} = u(\int \phi{dt}) ?

How do I specify the new initial conditions
 
Last edited:
Specifically:

##\frac{d \phi}{dt} = u(\int \phi(t) dt)##

Really there are two first order equations here. Do you see them?
 
I'm afraid I don't see them
 
You are given a specified piecewise function. It only has two values.
 
So does that mean the two equations are

\frac {d{\phi}}{dt} = -1 if ##u(\int \phi{dt}) \ge 0##
\frac {d{\phi}}{dt} = 1 if ##u(\int \phi{dt}) \lt 0##.

and if so, now how do I determine the new conditions?
 
Last edited:
Maylis said:
okay,
Are these two my new system of two first order equations? They don't have to be derivatives with respect to the same variable?
\phi = \frac{d{\theta}}{dt}
\frac{d^2{\theta}}{dt^2} = \frac{d{\phi}}{dt}
No, you put "\phi" in the wrong place!
\frac{d\phi}{dt}= u(\theta)

Therefore,
\frac{d^2{\theta}}{dt^2} = u(\int \phi{dt}) ?

How do I specify the new initial conditions

Your initial conditions were originally \theta(5)= \pi/2 and \theta&#039;(5)= \pi/10[/tex]<br /> so in terms of \theta and \phi[/tex] would be \theta(5)= \pi/2, \phi(5)= \pi/10.
 
HallsOfIvy,

So does that mean my two equation system is

##\frac {d{\phi}}{dt} = -1## if ##\theta \ge 0##

##\frac {d{\phi}}{dt} = 1## if ##\theta \lt 0## ??

with initial condition ##\phi(5) = \pi/10## and ##\dot{\theta}(5) = \pi/2##?? But then only one condition is in terms of ##\phi##, and the other in terms of ##\dot{\theta}##, is there a way to make the second one in terms of ##\phi##?
 
Last edited:
Back
Top