Standing waves: can two transverse waves colliding have diff. fq, or amplitude?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the conditions necessary for the formation of standing waves, specifically whether two transverse waves can have different frequencies and amplitudes while still producing a standing wave. The scope includes theoretical considerations and conceptual clarifications regarding wave interference and the characteristics of standing waves.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that for a pure standing wave, the two component traveling waves must have the same frequency and amplitude.
  • Others question what a non-pure standing wave would look like, suggesting that differing amplitudes could result in an antinode that does not reach zero.
  • A participant elaborates that if one wave has a larger amplitude and both waves have equal and opposite velocities and the same wavelength, the antinode would reflect the difference in amplitudes rather than reaching zero.
  • There is mention of the possibility of producing complex wave patterns if the wavelengths differ while maintaining the same amplitude, leading to a "sloshing" effect.
  • Mathematical expressions are provided to illustrate the relationships between wave parameters, including frequency, wavelength, and amplitude.
  • One participant suggests using visual aids or plotting software to better understand the interference of waves with differing amplitudes.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the conditions required for standing waves, with some asserting the necessity of equal frequency and amplitude, while others explore the implications of varying these parameters. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the exact nature of non-pure standing waves.

Contextual Notes

Limitations include assumptions about wave behavior under varying conditions, dependence on definitions of purity in standing waves, and the complexity introduced by differing wavelengths and amplitudes.

shangriphysics
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Do all standing waves have to have the same frequency and amplitude?
 
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To get a pure standing wave, the two component traveling waves must have the same frequency and amplitude. You can experiment with different frequencies and amplitudes to see what you get.
 
Ooo hmm, interesting interesting. I am having trouble seeing what a non pure standing wave would look like. Ex. If one wave had a bigger amplitude, then when they construct it would have an amplitude inbetween, but when they destruct, then the amplitude might never go to zero at the anti node.
 
shangriphysics said:
Ooo hmm, interesting interesting. I am having trouble seeing what a non pure standing wave would look like. Ex. If one wave had a bigger amplitude, then when they construct it would have an amplitude inbetween, but when they destruct, then the amplitude might never go to zero at the anti node.
That's right - but I'll be a tad more careful: if one wave had a bigger amplitude than the other, their velocities were equal and opposite, and their wavelengths were the same, then the antinode does not go to zero - but to the difference between the two amplitudes. Will the two waves always interfere to produce fixed nodes though? $$y(x,t)= A\sin k(x-vt) + B \sin k(x+vt) = \left[A\sin k(x-vt) + A\sin k(x+vt)\right] + (B-A)\sin k(x+vt)$$... see what I did there? The part in square brackets has a solution you already know.

If the wavelengths are slightly different, but the amplitudes are the same, then you can get a complicated form of sloshing about like waves in a bathtub.
$$y(x,t)= A\sin k_1(x-vt) +A\sin k_2(x+vt)$$ ... you can see from the equation you can change a bit about. It's even possible for the wave-speeds to depend on the wavelength.

Note: ##k=2\pi /\lambda## so ##kv = 2\pi f = \omega##

Sounds like you are a visual thinker - so the algebraic approach tends not to work well for you: you need a mental picture?
You may have had an example of adding equal waves by hand, by taking snapshots at carefully chosen regular time intervals ... have a go doing that for the case that one wave has twice the amplitude of the other.

If you have access to some plotting software, you can use it to make an animation.
Someone has probably already done it ...
 
Last edited:
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Thanks Simon Bridge! This was super helpful!
 

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