Statements about subrings and quotient

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In summary, the conversation discusses the properties of rings, subrings, and ideals. It is stated that if a ring is Noetherian, Artinian, P.I.D., U.F.D., or an euclidean domain, then its subring and quotient ring are also. However, the proofs given for 1 and 3 are not correct. A counter-example is needed for 1 and for 3, the ring $\mathbb{R}$ is suggested as a subring of $\mathbb{Z}$, which is non-Artinian. The conversation also discusses using the Hilbert basis theorem for finding a counter-example and using the correspondence theorem for rings.
  • #1
mathmari
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MHB
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Hey! :eek:

I want to check if the following statement are true.

Let $R$ be a ring, $S$ a subring and $I$ an ideal.

  1. If $R$ is Noetherian then $S$ is also.
  2. If $R$ is Noetherian then $R/I$ is also.
  3. If $R$ is Artinian then $S$ is also.
  4. If $R$ is Artinian then $R/I$ is also.
  5. If $R$ is P.I.D. then $S$ is also.
  6. If $R$ is P.I.D. then $R/I$ is also.
  7. If $R$ is U.F.D. then $S$ is also.
  8. If $R$ is U.F.D. then $R/I$ is also.
  9. If $R$ is an euclidean domain then $S$ is also.
I have done the following:

  1. $R$ is Noetherian iff each increasing sequence of ideal $I_1\subseteq I_2 \subseteq I_3 \subseteq \dots \subseteq I_k\subseteq \dots $ stops, i.e., $\exists k$ such that $I_k=I_{k+1}$, right?
    Then since $S$ is a subring of $R$, not all $I_i$ are contained in $S$. Therefore, the above condition isn't necessarily satisfied. So, $S$ is not necessarily Noetherian.
    is this correct? (Wondering)
  2. What can we say in that case? Does the increasing sequence stop? (Wondering)
  3. $R$ is Artinian iff each decreasing sequence of ideal $I_1\supseteq I_2 \supseteq I_3 \supseteq \dots \supseteq I_k\supseteq \dots $ stops, i.e., $\exists k$ such that $I_k=I_{k+1}$, right?
    Then since $S$ is a subring of $R$, not all $I_i$ are contained in $S$. Therefore, the above condition isn't necessarily satisfied. So, $S$ is not necessarily Artinian.
    is this correct? (Wondering)
  4. What can we say in that case? Does the decreasing sequence stop? (Wondering)
  5. If $R$ is P.I.D. then the ideals are prime, therefore $S$ contain also only prime ideals. So, $S$ is also P.I.D., right? (Wondering)
  6. What can we say in this case? (Wondering)
  7. If $R$ is U.F.D. then $\forall r\in R\setminus \{0\}$, $r\notin U(R)$: $r=a_1 \cdots a_k$ with $a_i$ irreducible, and if $r=a_1\cdots a_k=b_1\cdots b_t$ with $a_i, b_i$ irreducible then $k=t$ and $a_i=b_iu_i$ with $u_i\in U(R), \forall i=1, \dots , k$.
    Does the same hold also for $S$ ? (Wondering)
  8. And also in this case? (Wondering)
  9. How can we check that? (Wondering)
 
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  • #2
Your "proofs" for 1 & 3 are not correct. It is not the case that an ideal of a subring $S$ is an ideal of its containing ring $R$.

For example, $\Bbb Z$ is a subring of $\Bbb Q$, but $2\Bbb Z$ is an ideal of $\Bbb Q$, but not of $\Bbb Q$.

Also, just because some of the ideals of $R$ lie outside of $S$, does not mean that the ideals of $S$ fail to satisfy the Noetherian ascending chain condition.

What you want is a *counter-example*. Here is something to get you started on #1:

Any field is Noetherian, and any integral domain can be extended to a field. Can you find a non-Noetherian integral domain?

For 2, consider the correspondence theorem for rings.

For number 3, consider $S = \Bbb Z$. This ring is non-Artinian, can you find an Artinian ring it is a sub-ring of?

We'll discuss the other questions later.
 
  • #3
Deveno said:
Any field is Noetherian, and any integral domain can be extended to a field. Can you find a non-Noetherian integral domain?

Let $K$ be a field, then $K[x_1, x_2, \dots ]$ is not Noetherian, since the chain $(x_1) \subseteq (x_1, x_2) \subseteq \dots $ never stops, or not? (Wondering)
 
  • #4
Deveno said:
What you want is a *counter-example*. Here is something to get you started on #1:

Any field is Noetherian, and any integral domain can be extended to a field. Can you find a non-Noetherian integral domain?

Do we maybe use the Hilbert basis theorem?
Deveno said:
For 2, consider the correspondence theorem for rings.

How exactly do we use this theorem? I got stuck righ now? (Wondering)
Deveno said:
For number 3, consider $S = \Bbb Z$. This ring is non-Artinian, can you find an Artinian ring it is a sub-ring of?

The only ideals of $\mathbb{R}$ are $0$ and $\mathbb{R}$.
So, the sequence $\mathbb{R}\supset 0$ is finite, therefore $\mathbb{R}$ is Artinian, right? (Wondering)
 

Related to Statements about subrings and quotient

1. What is a subring?

A subring is a subset of a ring that is itself a ring with the same operations and identity element as the original ring.

2. How do you determine if a set is a subring?

To determine if a set is a subring, it must satisfy the following conditions: it must be a subset of the original ring, it must contain the identity element of the original ring, it must be closed under addition and multiplication, and it must have additive and multiplicative inverses for each element.

3. What is a quotient ring?

A quotient ring, also known as a factor ring, is a ring obtained by partitioning the elements of a ring into equivalence classes based on a specific subset, and then defining operations on these classes.

4. How do you find the elements of a quotient ring?

The elements of a quotient ring are the equivalence classes formed by dividing the elements of the original ring by the specific subset that defines the equivalence relation. These classes are represented by the elements in the quotient ring.

5. What is the relationship between a subring and a quotient ring?

A quotient ring is formed by partitioning a ring into equivalence classes, while a subring is a subset of a ring. So, a quotient ring can be thought of as a subring that is formed by dividing the original ring into smaller subrings.

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