Steady Flow, Thermodynamics First Law

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around a thermodynamics problem involving a reversible steady flow process of a fluid. Participants analyze the application of the first law of thermodynamics to determine changes in enthalpy and work done during the process, while addressing specific fluid properties and calculations.

Discussion Character

  • Homework-related
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a problem statement involving fluid properties and seeks assistance in calculating changes in enthalpy and work done.
  • Another participant points out that specific volume can be calculated as the inverse of density (V = 1/ρ).
  • A participant expresses confusion regarding the nature of the process, questioning whether it is truly reversible or adiabatic.
  • Clarifications are provided regarding the interpretation of the equation used, suggesting that it can be applied per unit mass or multiplied by mass flow rate for total work and heat per unit time.
  • Participants discuss the calculation of work done, with one participant providing a specific equation and values, seeking confirmation on the correctness of their arithmetic and approach.
  • Another participant acknowledges the conceptual assistance provided but does not verify the arithmetic of the calculations presented.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the correctness of the calculations or the interpretation of the process. There are multiple viewpoints regarding the nature of the process and the appropriate application of the first law of thermodynamics.

Contextual Notes

Some participants express uncertainty about specific values and assumptions, such as the initial and final elevations in the context of the problem. There are also discussions about unit conversions and the implications of the fluid's properties on the calculations.

Perodamh
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Homework Statement


12kg of a fluid per minute goes through a reversible steady flow process. The properties of fluid at the inlet are p1 = 1.4bar, ρ1 = 25kg/m3, C1= 120m/s and u1= 920kJ/kg and at the exit are p2= 5.6bar, ρ
2= 5 kg/m3, C2= 180m/s and u2

Homework Equations



u1 + P1V1 + (C1)2/2 + g.Z + Q = u2 + P2V2 + (C2)2/2 + g.Z + W

u1 + P1V1 and u2 + P2V2 are both enthalpies

The Attempt at a Solution


i)
h1-h2 = change in enthalpy
plugging in values gives (920kj/kg + 1.4*V) - (720kj/kg + 5.6*V)
920kj/kg + 1.4*V - 720kj/kg - 5.6*V
200kj/kg - 4.2*V
but how do I get what V is since it wasn't given and I believe it means specific volume. I probably got it wrong, educate me. And also for the second question how do I go about finding W if Q is not given. Thanks a lot [/B]
 
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You are aware that ##V=1/\rho##, correct?
 
Chestermiller said:
You are aware that ##V=1/\rho##, correct?
OF COURSE, it is. I should take my time with formulas, thank you. Can I run the answer with you once I retry and i'd also try the second part again and see if I can figure that part out?
 
Perodamh said:
OF COURSE, it is. I should take my time with formulas, thank you. Can I run the answer with you once I retry and i'd also try the second part again and see if I can figure that part out?
Of course
 
Chestermiller said:
Of course
Apologies for my late reply. I've been working on the question and ran into S.I unit issues and I got -93.6kJ/kg for the first one.
The second one on the other hand, using the relation W = - [(u2 + P2V2) - (u1 + P1V1) + ((C2)2/2) - ((C1)2/2) + (g.Z2 - g.Z1 ) - Q]
Correct me if I'm wrong but to get Q do I divide the fluid reject in the question being 60kJ/s by the mass rate and also how do I get Z2 or Z1, a fluid rise was given as 60m, does that mean the initial is 0 and the final is 60? I've really tried in finding these out, I'd still keep trying but any assistance would be appreciated. Thanks
 
I really don’t understand what you are saying. Are there two separate and distinct problems? Is the process really supposed to be reversible, or is it adiabatic, not reversible?
 
Chestermiller said:
I really don’t understand what you are saying. Are there two separate and distinct problems? Is the process really supposed to be reversible, or is it adiabatic, not reversible?
This is the question "12kg of a fluid per minute goes through a reversible steady flow process. The properties of fluid of fluid at the inlet are p1 = 1.4bar, ρ1 = 25kg/m^3, C1 = 120m/s and u2 = 920 kJ/kg and the exit are p2 = 5.6bar, ρ2 = 5kg/m^3, C2 = 180m/s and u2 = 720kJ/kg. During the passage, the fluid rejects 60KJ/s and rises through 60m. Determine i) the change in enthalpy ii) work done during the process".
 
The form of the equation you are using applies per unit mass passing through the system. You can solve your problem in this form, or you can multiply the entire equation by the mass flow rate to get the work and heat per unit time. I suggest keeping the current form, and working per unit mass. In that case, the 60 kJ/s is the same as 60/(12/60) kJ/kg. Your interpretation of the elevations z is correct.
 
Chestermiller said:
The form of the equation you are using applies per unit mass passing through the system. You can solve your problem in this form, or you can multiply the entire equation by the mass flow rate to get the work and heat per unit time. I suggest keeping the current form, and working per unit mass. In that case, the 60 kJ/s is the same as 60/(12/60) kJ/kg. Your interpretation of the elevations z is correct.
Thanks, i'd work towards an answer for the second question, but what do you think of the first, I got -93.6kJ/kg?
 
  • #10
I just solved for the second plugging in values I got w = -[ -93.6 * 10^3 + ((180^2)/2 - (120^2)/2) + ((60 * 9.81) - 0) - 300 * 10^3] which is equal to 384.0114 kJ/kg? Tell me where I've got it wrong if there are any errors. Thanks
 
  • #11
Perodamh said:
I just solved for the second plugging in values I got w = -[ -93.6 * 10^3 + ((180^2)/2 - (120^2)/2) + ((60 * 9.81) - 0) - 300 * 10^3] which is equal to 384.0114 kJ/kg? Tell me where I've got it wrong if there are any errors. Thanks
I've too lazy to check your arithmetic. I've been pleased to help you with the conceptual problem of how to apply the first law to an open system.
 
  • #12
Chestermiller said:
I've too lazy to check your arithmetic. I've been pleased to help you with the conceptual problem of how to apply the first law to an open system.
Aah, that's awesome all the same, thanks a lot.
 

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