The Probability that N and E bridge hands have the same number of spades?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around calculating the probability that two players, N and E, have the same number of spades in their hands when dealing four labeled 13-card hands from a standard 52-card deck. Participants explore various methods of counting outcomes, applying combinatorial reasoning, and estimating probabilities, with a focus on both exact calculations and rough estimates.

Discussion Character

  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant presents a detailed combinatorial approach to calculate the probability, defining events related to the number of spades each player has.
  • Another participant questions the initial counting method, suggesting that the distribution of cards between players S and W was not fully accounted for.
  • A rough estimate of the probability is proposed, suggesting that N and E could have two, three, or four spades each with equal probability, leading to a total estimate of about 18%.
  • Further calculations are provided by another participant, refining the probability to approximately 0.177 based on their computations.
  • One participant suggests an alternative approach by considering a general case with a variable number of cards, indicating a desire to simplify the problem by not partitioning cards between S and W.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the accuracy of the initial calculations, with some proposing alternative methods and estimates. There is no consensus on a definitive probability value, as various approaches yield different results.

Contextual Notes

Some calculations depend on specific assumptions about card distributions and the independence of events, which may not be fully resolved. The discussion includes various methods of counting and estimating probabilities without reaching a final agreement on the correct approach.

Who May Find This Useful

Readers interested in combinatorial probability, card games, or mathematical reasoning in probability theory may find this discussion relevant.

Entertainment Unit
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TL;DR
The question: suppose we deal four 13-card bridge hands from an ordinary 52-card deck. What is the probability that the North and East hands each have exactly the same number of spades?

I have an answer, but I can't find a solution anywhere to confirm it, and it's a little beyond my programming ability at the moment to do a brute force solution.

Is my answer correct? If not, where did I go wrong?
My answer is as follows:

Let ##S## be the set of all outcomes of dealing four labelled 13-card hands from a standard 52-card deck.

Let ##A## be event "N and E have exactly the same number of spades."

Let ##A_i## be event "N and E have exactly ##i## spades each."

Note that when ##i > 6##, ##\mathbb {P}(A_i) = 0## since there are only 13 spades in a standard deck of cards.

In the case of event ##A_0##, there are
  • ##2^{13}## ways to deal the 13 spades into hands S and W,
  • ##\binom {39} {13}## ways to "top up" hands S and W, and
  • ##\frac {26!}{13!13!}## ways to partition the remaining cards into hands N and E.
By the fundamental principle of counting, ##|A_0| = 2^{13} \binom {39}{13} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##.

In the case of event ##A_1##, there are
  • ##\binom {13}{2}## ways to assign 1 spade each to hands N and E,
  • ##\binom {50}{24}## ways to "top up" hands N and E, and
  • ##\frac {26!}{13!13!}## ways to partition the remaining cards into hands S and W.
By the fundamental principle of counting, ##|A_1| = \binom {13}{2} \binom {50}{24} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##.

By similar logic to that used to find the cardinality of event ##A_1##:
  • ##|A_2| = \binom {13}{4} \binom {48}{22} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##
  • ##|A_3| = \binom {13}{6} \binom {46}{20} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##
  • ##|A_4| = \binom {13}{8} \binom {44}{18} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##
  • ##|A_5| = \binom {13}{10} \binom {42}{16} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##
  • ##|A_6| = \binom {13}{12} \binom {40}{14} \frac {26!}{13!13!}##
Since the events ##A_i, i \in \{0,1,2,3,4,5,6\}## are disjoint,
##|A| = |\bigcup_{i \in \{0,1,2,3,4,5,6\}} A_i| = \sum_{i=0}^6 |A_i|##​

By the Discrete Uniform Probability Law,

##\mathbb {P}(A) =\frac {|A|}{|S|} = \frac {|A|}{\frac {52!}{13!13!13!13!}} = \frac {507696703}{31260638524067527680000}##​

Is this correct? If not, where did I go wrong?

Edit: updated answer, but it's still likely wrong.
 
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Entertainment Unit said:
By the Discrete Uniform Probability Law,

##\mathbb {P}(A) =\frac {|A|}{|S|} = \frac {|A|}{\frac {52!}{13!13!13!13!}} = \frac {91957}{1508157204050}##​

Is this correct? If not, where did I go wrong?

That looks like a very small number. I make it about 18%.
 
Entertainment Unit said:
In the case of event A0A0A_0, there are
  • 2132132^{13} ways to deal the 13 spades into hands S and W,
  • (3913)(3913)\binom {39} {13} ways to "top up" hands S and W, and
You only count, the number of ways 13 cards can be selected to "top up" S and W, but not the number of ways these can be divided between S and W.
 
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Here's a rough estimate:

Let's say that North gets two, three or four spades with roughly equal probability of ##1/4##, leaving ##1/4## for everything else. And, assume that East gets the same independent of what North has.

That gives us an approximate probability of ##1/16## for North and East to have two spades each and the same for three spades each and four spades each. That's a total of ##3/16##. That's a first guess.

To calculate the number accurately, we take the six cases where E and N share zero to six spades.

The number of ways that N has ##n## spades is:
$$N(n)= \binom{13}{n}\binom{39}{13-n}$$
The total number of N hands is:
$$N = \binom{52}{13}$$
Then for East we have (given that N has ##n## spades):
$$E(n) = \binom{13-n}{n}\binom{26+n}{13-n}$$
And the total number of East hands is:
$$E = \binom{39}{13}$$
Then the probability that N and E both have ##n## spades is:
$$P(n) = \frac{N(n)}{N} \frac{E(n)}{E}$$
And you can sum the six resulting probabilities. The most likely, for example, is three spades each, which has a probability of about ##8 \%##. And the total probability is about ##18\%##, which is a bit less than the rough estimate above.
 
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Thanks for the help! I finally got ##\frac {28035698399}{158753389900} \approx 0.177##.
 
I didn't solve the problem, but I would be inclined to attack it via the general case: 4N cards in a deck, and work it out by hand for N=1, 2 and maybe 3. Once I get it right for N, plug in N=13.

For example, I would not be trying to partition cards between S and W.
 

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