Total derivative of integral seen as a functional, how?

In summary, the conversation discusses the concept of total derivatives and their various notations, including the use of the symbol ##\delta##. The speaker also brings up the application of total derivatives in physics, particularly in relation to Lagrangian equations. They question the algebraic types of the left and right sides of an equation involving total derivatives and integrals. The other person in the conversation suggests that there is no consistency in notation for derivatives and that the symbol ##\delta## may simply represent the derivative of a function.
  • #1
birulami
155
0
To be specific, with total derivative I mean the linear map that best approximates a given function [itex]f[/itex] at a given point. For [itex]f:ℝ\toℝ[/itex] we have [itex]D(f,x_0):ℝ\toℝ[/itex], i.e. [itex]D(f,x_0)(h) \in ℝ[/itex]. Often it is also denoted as just [itex]\delta f[/itex].

Now in physics, in particular in the area of the Lagrangian, I find the following. Let [itex]S_{a,b}(f) = \int_a^b f(x)dx[/itex] a functional that maps functions [itex]f[/itex] to the real line. Then [itex]D(S_{a,b},f) = \delta S_{a,b}[/itex] should be well defined given any necessary smoothness conditions. In particular [itex]D(S_{a,b},f)[/itex] maps functions [itex]h[/itex] of the same type of [itex]f[/itex] to real numbers. Because the integral is linear, so my hunch, its best linear approximation should be itself. Yet in a physics course, equation 1.5, first line, I find what I understand to be

[tex]\delta \int_a^b f(x) dx = \int_a^b \delta f dx[/tex]

Can anyone explain how the algebraic types on the left and on the right would match up? My interpretation is, that on the left I have a the total derivative of a functional, which itself should be a functional, written explicitly as [itex]D(S_{a,b},f)[/itex]. On the right I have the integral over, hmm, the total derivative of [itex]f[/itex], where I don't see how this could be a functional?

Any hints appreciated.
 
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  • #2
When it comes to derivatives, the notations are even more varying than the perspectives of a derivative itself. I think you put too much interpretation into the ##\delta## notation. The LHS is the derivative of a real number? Doesn't make sense, but I don't see the functional either. I read it as ##\delta F = \int f'## where ##F## denotes the antiderivative of ##f## and ##f'## its derivative. Hence it is a version of the fundamental theorem of calculus written in another way. As mentioned, do not expect consistency in notation of derivatives.

https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/the-pantheon-of-derivatives-i/
 

Related to Total derivative of integral seen as a functional, how?

1. What is the total derivative of an integral?

The total derivative of an integral is the derivative of the integral with respect to a variable or parameter in the integrand. It is denoted as d/dx∫ f(x)dx and represents the rate of change of the integral as x varies.

2. How is the total derivative of an integral calculated?

The total derivative of an integral is calculated using the fundamental theorem of calculus, which states that the integral of a function f(x) can be calculated by finding the antiderivative F(x) and evaluating it at the upper and lower limits of integration. The total derivative is then found by taking the derivative of F(x) with respect to x.

3. Why is the total derivative of an integral important?

The total derivative of an integral is important because it allows us to calculate the rate of change of an integral over a certain interval. This is useful in many fields of science and engineering, such as in physics to calculate the velocity of an object or in economics to calculate the rate of change of a cost function.

4. Can the total derivative of an integral be negative?

Yes, the total derivative of an integral can be negative. This occurs when the integral is decreasing over the specified interval, resulting in a negative rate of change. Similarly, it can also be positive if the integral is increasing.

5. What is the difference between the total derivative and partial derivative of an integral?

The total derivative of an integral considers the change in the integral with respect to a single variable or parameter, while the partial derivative of an integral considers the change in the integral with respect to multiple variables. The total derivative is often used to calculate the rate of change over a specific interval, while the partial derivative is used to find the sensitivity of the integral to changes in different variables.

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