Dismiss Notice
Join Physics Forums Today!
The friendliest, high quality science and math community on the planet! Everyone who loves science is here!

What would be needed for Utopia?

  1. Oct 27, 2004 #1
    What would be needed for Utopia?

    A question I had after starting brave new world.
  2. jcsd
  3. Oct 27, 2004 #2
    You'd need everyone to work hard, and no one to want more than anyone else.

    Wouldn't work, you're always going to get people who want more than others. Even if they don't obtain "more" by malicious means, you still get people who just work harder than others, and then you get people who don't work at all.
  4. Oct 28, 2004 #3
    I also belive that Utopia is impossible, but you could get close to an enviornment where everyone is happy by extreme means.
  5. Oct 28, 2004 #4
    Lets say that the earth's population was mostly destroyed and its up to you to rebuild the world...you want to build a utopia. You take the leading scientists and you work on building specific types of people... intelligent peope, workers, labor force. similar idea to what happens in BNW

  6. Nov 1, 2004 #5
    there's a book. The Giver. read it.
  7. Nov 2, 2004 #6
    what would be needed? no humanity thats for sure. humans are greedy, selfish and overall very rageful creatures. everyonce in a while there are a few good ones....but overall, i mean just look at the state of the world for example. and no matter what you want to think, everyone is selfish.
  8. Nov 2, 2004 #7
    i strongly disagree. in general i think most human beings are relatively decent. it's the very few who aren't that give the rest of us a bad name. the minority always speaks the loudest. you see a lot of stupid, selfish, arrogant people on tv because that's what makes news. the majority of us who are halfway kind and unselfish never get noticed, but i'd estimate we make up a good 80% of the population.

    "We hang the petty thieves and appoint the great ones to public office." - Aesop
  9. Nov 3, 2004 #8
    to have an utopia you would need a fully functional comunist government with no corruption,

    or build robots that would do every job possible, and just let humans live as if they were noblemen of all times and such
  10. Nov 3, 2004 #9
    i am terrified of your idea of utopia
  11. Nov 4, 2004 #10


    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Gold Member
    Dearly Missed

    It has always been the case that one person's utopia is another person's hell.
  12. Nov 4, 2004 #11
    And it is not necessarily the case that one person's utopia is not also his own hell.
  13. Nov 4, 2004 #12


    User Avatar
    Staff Emeritus
    Gold Member
    Dearly Missed

    "Be careful what you wish for; you might get it."
  14. Nov 4, 2004 #13
    whether utopia is is possible is based on your definition. I think that we would be in a utopian world if everybody followed one rule: that you should consider other people more important than yourself.

    puf, although i mainly agree with you, abitofnothing is also right. I doubt that 80% of us are good and wholehearted. there are problbly 20% that are selfish and greedy etc. as you said but about 75% is affected by these people
    Since "bad" people are often "cool" or "famous" people tend to think that if you act like them you will be as "cool as they are.
  15. Nov 5, 2004 #14

    uh huh. 80%? are you kidding me? why is it that those Amnesty Int. commercials need to resort to those horrible images of starving children in order to make someone give them 10 cents a day? why is it that in order for people to give to any charity really, the organization must resort to horrible images or pain, suffering, malnutrition, death, etc in order for people to give a little? its because the majority of the world is greedy. isnt it a horrible thing that people have to resort to making other feel guilty in order for them to give a little. 10 cents. a dime that most people drop on the ground and are too damn lazy to even just bend over and pick it up as they walk is something that could feed a child in another country. look at those commercials and you're telling me that people arent greedy? look at all of those shiny cars, big houses, diamonds and gold and jewllery that people have. do they actually NEED that stuff? or could they give a little? people just dont want to admit that there's a problem with the world and they could be a part of helping it but they are just too greedy and lazy to do so.

    i do agree with you that there are SOME good people but even those who are going things out of the good of their heart are selfish. Mother Teresa for example, wanted to help people, her self-satisfying goal was to help people and she did.....did she not satisfy her self by doing so? dont get me wrong. selfishness is not always a bad thing. but it still exists.

    "No drug, not even alcohol, causes the fundamental ills of society. If we're looking for the source of our troubles, we shouldn't test people for drugs, we should test them for stupidity, ignorance, greed and love of power." -P. J. O'Rourke

    "Love is blind, and greed insatiable"-chinese proverb
  16. Nov 5, 2004 #15
    Citizen's side:

    No pride.
    No ambition.
    No hope.
    No temptation to argue.

    A utopia is impossible on earth because it defies the laws of mortal human nature.

    A dystopia is possible. However, 1: it will not be 100% evil/bad (since to get the most evil you must first deform the good), 2: it is easily destructable.
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 5, 2004
  17. Nov 5, 2004 #16
    i agree with dekoi here! :blushing:
  18. Nov 5, 2004 #17
    wouldn't the same be true for any kind of utopia? i mean, define it like that and anything's possible.

    as far as my comment about most people being good, i think you guys took my definition of "good" too far. i'm not saying 80% of the population is made up of saints, i'm saying that 80% of the people in the world don't actively promote "evil", and for the most part will help someone else out. as an example u could do a survey. ask strangers for directions in a mall. the people who try to help u i bet would outnumber the ones who brush u off 4-1.
    i do have to agree that all people are inherently selfish. and i would apply the same to religions. "Obey my commandments and look what you get! a nice fancy mansion in heaven!" or something similar. the definitions change, but the root is the same, follow the rules and be rewarded.
    so when it comes to utopia, i guess what would most be needed is a religion that promotes doing good for its own sake with no promise of reward. can't ya see how popular that religion would be? ;)
  19. Nov 6, 2004 #18
    Complete and full knowledge of all there is to know! Man-God relation becomes then fully levelled!
  20. Nov 6, 2004 #19
    why does there need to be a religion for there to be a utopia? ouldn't it be nice if there didnt have to be?
  21. Nov 6, 2004 #20

    Well i think that as this discussion developes, it will become important to clearly give a definite definition of a "utopia".

    Could this 'utopia' act against human nature? Such as human birth, and fetus developement as an example.

    Or does this utopia have to satisfy the true needs and moral standards of all humans? As you might have answered so yourself: that would be impossible with mortal humans (on Earth),
Share this great discussion with others via Reddit, Google+, Twitter, or Facebook