Why Does the Phase Shift Oscillator Frequency Drop with the TL072?

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The discussion centers on the observed frequency drop in a phase shift oscillator when using the TL072 op-amp instead of an ideal op-amp, with a noted decrease of about 15%. The primary cause of this frequency reduction is attributed to the parasitic phase shift introduced by the TL072, which deviates from ideal behavior, particularly at the designed oscillation frequency of approximately 60 kHz. Participants emphasize the importance of analyzing the closed-loop gain and phase shift of the op-amp, as well as the effects of feedback on the overall circuit performance. The conversation also touches on the need for simulations to validate theoretical predictions and the complexities involved in accurately modeling real op-amps. Understanding the phase contributions from both the feedback network and the op-amp is crucial for determining the actual oscillation frequency.
  • #31
rude man said:
The second loop is the feedback resistor around the op amp. It's a loop inside the major loop which you cite.
I think, speaking about two loops really will confuse the OP.
For my opinion, it makes not much sense to arbitrarily define an internal loop consisting of an opamp and a feedback resistor only.
Such a "loop" would have a loop gain of infinity (ideal opamp).
Remember: The oscillation condition for all 4-pole oscillators involves one single loop only.
Obviously - a simple visual inspection confirms that the phase shift oscillator topology consists of a single closed loop which contains a frequency-determining RC block in series with a finite gain inverting amplifier. This view reflects the principle of this oscillator type.

Comment: Even in case of the WIEN oscillator (where the combination of positive and negative feedback formally would allow a definition of 2 loops) it makes no sense to define two loops because the common approach using an ideal opamp would give infinite loop gain. Instead, the opamp with negative feedback is, of course, considered as a fixed-gain block.
Hence, we have again the classical single-loop oscillatory system.
 

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