Odds of Finding Alien Life: An Exploration

In summary, the conversation discusses the likelihood of finding alien life and the potential obstacles to intergalactic and interstellar travel. The Fermi paradox is mentioned, which questions why, if there are so many planets capable of supporting life, no intelligent species has visited Earth. The Drake equation is also brought up, which estimates the probability of intelligent life in the Milky Way. Some believe that we may find alien life within the next 100 years, while others argue that the vastness of the universe makes it highly improbable. The conversation also touches on the potential for societal and technological advancements to impact our ability to explore and colonize other planets. Ultimately, the conversation ends with the idea that Earth may have been colonized in the past, but any
  • #71
There is too much space for no life to be out there.. As I said in my other post on "Is the Earth at the center of the Universe?"
Space is never ending. But inside space, bubbles form. In which forms different atmospheres in those bubbles. There is roughly trillions of bubbles forming as we speak.
But yes, I think Alien life exists..

Good luck,
-Derek
 
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  • #72
There is one almost unknown Fermi paradox solution which I think is the best.
The logic of the solution is as follows: to communicate and to rule across the vastness of space, any advanced interstellar civilization will have to synchronize the proper time of its starship travelers and couriers with the proper time of the star metropolis (the center of the civilization). In other words, to compensate for the time dilation of light-speed couriers and communications, the entire civilization has to become mobile and mobile at the speed of light. It may include mass transit technologies like teleportation. Corresponding time dilation makes the communication with such civilization almost impossible. The estimate is that our civilization can achieve this level of technology by the middle of this century. In fact, modern fiber optics, and satellite radio lines allow for information to travel close to the speed of light (it is OK for non-biological ET, like AI virtual personalities). See also an article in Philica on Fermi paradox: http://philica.com/display_article.php?article_id=184
 
  • #73
D H said:
If we stick to discussions of solutions of the Fermi paradox in this thread, the thread might have a chance to continue on. If this thread continues with the overly speculative posts and high school histrionics that have plagued this thread so far, it will be locked.

DH, that is exactly what I suggest too. That is to repeat that there exist one scientific solution to the paradox which explains that they may be not intentionally hiding - and still are everywhere (mobile civilization utilizing light speed in the everyday life, see my previous post).
 
  • #74
LURCH said:
Another proposed solution is to invoke the famous "Prime Directive," stating that other advanced civilizations exist, they are here in our neighbourhood, but they refrain from making contact. Again, this is not impossible, but no real-world examples can be found. Whenever one civilization has encountered another on this planet, contact is immediately made (often to the detriment of the less technologically advanced civilization)

They may exist and "be everywhere" and not refrain from the contact but the communication still may be impossible. Consider the case of communication with the star traveler moving almost with the speed of light. Small talk can take thousand of years due to the time dilation. And the jetliner passengers would not jump out just to stare at the crawling ant.
 
  • #75
Limitless777 said:
There is one almost unknown Fermi paradox solution which I think is the best.

the entire civilization has to become mobile and mobile at the speed of light. It may include mass transit technologies like teleportation. Corresponding time dilation makes the communication with such civilization almost impossible.

How is this a solution? Given you can't accelerate an object with mass to the speed of light, it doesn't solve anything.
The estimate is that our civilization can achieve this level of technology by the middle of this century.

"Our civilization"? And whose estimate is this? Certainly not one based in reality. We aren't even close to anything of the sort.

First you propose wee need to travel at the speed of light and then you say we can do so mid 21st century. Nonsense.
In fact, modern fiber optics, and satellite radio lines allow for information to travel close to the speed of light

Those two allow information to travel at the speed of light. It is only the encoding / decoding phases that give a 'delay', but the signal itself is at light speed.
 
  • #76
I think I am a little late to this thread, but I'm surprised no one has discussed the Rare Earth Theory in this thread. Basically, this theory attempts to add in new developments in our understanding of astrobiolgy, astrophysics, planetary formation, and cosmology to the original Drake Equation in order to come up with an improved, more modern, and more realistic formula for the number of advanced civilizations in our galaxy. They add in a bunch of factors not considered in the Drake equation, such as the benefits of having an extremely large moon to stabilize a planet's tilt along its axis, the presence of a large Jupiter to guard the rocky inner planets from excessive bombardment by wayward asteroids and comets as well as the frequency and timing of the impacts that DO occur, beneficial locations within galactic spiral arms (eg galactic habitable zones in addition to the already considered planetary habitable zones), metallicity of planets, types of planetary orbits, and numerous other factors. The Rare Earth Theory takes a pretty realistic approach to evaluating new factors that Drake never did. Depending on your viewpoint on the new factors they introduce, the number of advanced alien civilizations in our galaxy other than us may be as low as 0. They do, however, believe that primitive life is common. It is certainly an interesting theory that deserves some consideration.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rare_Earth_hypothesis
 
  • #77
JaredJames said:
How is this a solution? Given you can't accelerate an object with mass to the speed of light, it doesn't solve anything.
"Our civilization"? And whose estimate is this? Certainly not one based in reality. We aren't even close to anything of the sort.
First you propose wee need to travel at the speed of light and then you say we can do so mid 21st century. Nonsense.
First, you may consider this as an estimate of one prominent futurist and a famous inventor, Ray Kurzweil. He has already proved many times that he is pretty good in technological predictions. According to his estimates, our civilization will become mostly non-biological to the year 2045. It means that most of thinking creatures (virtual personalities) to this year will be traveling virtually through the networks similar to Internet - at the speed of light. It is obvious that for those, who is massless there is no need to accelerate.
Second, you are wrong, there exist promising ideas on light speed travel for massive objects too, so your thesis is not "given". I don't want to discuss these ideas here, but you may consider, for example, the fact that the Dirac equation for massive particle (4-spinor) may be transformed into two equations for massless Weyl 2-spinors. It means by the way that from the certain point of view fermion particles like electron, proton, etc. are moving at the speed of light all the time (no need to accelerate). It is well-known in quantum theory "jiggling" effect. Future inventors may find a way to utilize this.
 
  • #78
Limitless777 said:
First, you may consider this as an estimate of one prominent futurist and a famous inventor, Ray Kurzweil. He has already proved many times that he is pretty good in technological predictions. According to his estimates, our civilization will become mostly non-biological to the year 2045. It means that most of thinking creatures (virtual personalities) to this year will be traveling virtually through the networks similar to Internet - at the speed of light. It is obvious that for those, who is massless there is no need to accelerate.

These ideas have already been discussed here only a few weeks back. I believe the thread was locked for non-sense claims such as these. There is no substance to them.
Second, you are wrong, there exist promising ideas on light speed travel for massive objects too, so your thesis is not "given". I don't want to discuss these ideas here, but you may consider, for example, the fact that the Dirac equation for massive particle (4-spinor) may be transformed into two equations for massless Weyl 2-spinors. It means by the way that from the certain point of view fermion particles like electron, proton, etc. are moving at the speed of light all the time (no need to accelerate). It is well-known in quantum theory "jiggling" effect. Future inventors may find a way to utilize this.

As far as I'm aware, the only methods for FTL travel for massive objects involve 'exotic' as of yet, non-existent entities.

Also, I'm not sure how interchangeable micro and macro scale matters are.
 
  • #79
Thread closed pending Moderation of necroposts by Limitless777...
 
<h2>1. What are the odds of finding alien life?</h2><p>The odds of finding alien life are difficult to determine, as there is currently no definitive evidence of extraterrestrial life. However, many scientists believe that the universe is vast and contains billions of potentially habitable planets, increasing the chances of finding alien life.</p><h2>2. What methods are being used to search for alien life?</h2><p>Scientists use a variety of methods to search for alien life, including radio telescopes to listen for potential signals from other civilizations, space probes to explore planets and moons in our solar system, and spectroscopy to analyze the chemical composition of exoplanets.</p><h2>3. How do scientists define "life" in the search for extraterrestrial life?</h2><p>Scientists typically define life as a self-sustaining system capable of reproduction, metabolism, and evolution. However, this definition may need to be expanded or modified in the search for alien life, as we may encounter forms of life that are drastically different from what we know on Earth.</p><h2>4. What are the potential implications of discovering alien life?</h2><p>The discovery of alien life would have significant implications for our understanding of the universe and our place in it. It could also have practical implications, such as advancements in technology and medicine based on studying alien biology.</p><h2>5. How would we communicate with alien life if we were to find it?</h2><p>Communicating with alien life would be a complex and challenging task. Scientists have proposed various methods, such as using mathematics or universal symbols, to attempt communication. However, it is also possible that alien life may communicate in ways that we cannot even imagine.</p>

1. What are the odds of finding alien life?

The odds of finding alien life are difficult to determine, as there is currently no definitive evidence of extraterrestrial life. However, many scientists believe that the universe is vast and contains billions of potentially habitable planets, increasing the chances of finding alien life.

2. What methods are being used to search for alien life?

Scientists use a variety of methods to search for alien life, including radio telescopes to listen for potential signals from other civilizations, space probes to explore planets and moons in our solar system, and spectroscopy to analyze the chemical composition of exoplanets.

3. How do scientists define "life" in the search for extraterrestrial life?

Scientists typically define life as a self-sustaining system capable of reproduction, metabolism, and evolution. However, this definition may need to be expanded or modified in the search for alien life, as we may encounter forms of life that are drastically different from what we know on Earth.

4. What are the potential implications of discovering alien life?

The discovery of alien life would have significant implications for our understanding of the universe and our place in it. It could also have practical implications, such as advancements in technology and medicine based on studying alien biology.

5. How would we communicate with alien life if we were to find it?

Communicating with alien life would be a complex and challenging task. Scientists have proposed various methods, such as using mathematics or universal symbols, to attempt communication. However, it is also possible that alien life may communicate in ways that we cannot even imagine.

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