Medical Autsim -many people does not care

[Spirit]

Hey,

I have read many articles regarding Autism but I think i have not grasp even its basics in an excellent way.

I wonder: Does individuals with Autism really 'do not care' about others since they don't interact with other people as more than 'objects' or a bit more than objects. Some articles i read did claim this in a way or in another. However; I found in the new society there TONS of individuals who don't consider others, and commit crimes, wether it be in the battlefields or in the offices in politics or that fight with a younger boy after school.

Thx in advance for help, truly appreciated

 

[Evo]

Some articles i read did claim this in a way or in another. However; I found in the new society there TONS of individuals who don't consider others, and commit crimes, wether it be in the battlefields or in the offices in politics or that fight with a younger boy after school.

I seriously doubt that someone holding political office or a soldier or a school yard bully would suffer from autism.

I suggest you read this to understand better. http://www.nimh.nih.gov/publicat/autism.cfm

 

[alias25]

I get really emotional attached to object a lot it causes a lot of stress sometimes when no one seems to understand people think I am selfish sometimes, if somethings mine i want to keep it forever..guess I am very sentimental, most objects have very deep meaning too me even the most randomest thing, an everyday object. i guess i can understand why autistic people may have unusual attachments to objects and as for not interacting with people possibly because theyre afraid of getting hurt? because they are in fact very emotional and care about people so feel vunrable and afraid, these are only my opinions.
is autism genetic?

 

[Kurdt]

i guess i can understand why autistic people may have unusual attachments to objects and as for not interacting with people possibly because theyre afraid of getting hurt? because they are in fact very emotional and care about people so feel vunrable and afraid, these are only my opinions.
is autism genetic?

People with autism are not afraid of getting hurt by interaction with others. They have problems understanding other people as they can't recognise subtelties of body language and in more severe cases have poor spoken and listening language skills. And in response to the OP, it is not that people with autism do not care they merely find it as difficult to express themselves effectively as they do in understanding.

There is some evidence to suggest autism is genetic but I suggest you visit the link that Evo provided if you are curious.

 

[arildno]

Since the theory of autism has been developed by non-autists, the subjective, experential aspects of being autistic is a mere conjecture from the side of non-autists.
Thus, that part of the theory is of no scientific weight.

Descriptions of how autists interacts with other, however, may be of great value.

 

[J77]

There was a recent bbc story into how common the condition is: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/5174144.stm

However, some trouble with making a condition common is that, for example, people who are slower to learn may get "put on the spectrum" when other diagnoses may apply.

A bit like how all badly behaved kids these days must have ADHD.

And back to the OP, I don't think it's quite as simple as "interacting with people as objects". Like you say, it's hard to grasp. Mainly because of the broad spectrum...

But I still think that such a spectrum shouldn't grow to enable a diagnosis of shy, retiring people as autistic.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

My son is autistic. As indicated in the article linked to by Evo, we were aware of the problem almost from birth, but it was not diagnosed until he was nearly 3 years old. We were advised to look into the possibility as the result of bringing him for a hearing test. We went through various stages of denial until this past year with him at the age of 12.

It is rather difficult to describe exactly what is different about my son. He is personable, makes eye contact, is intelligent (though not a savant like Rainman), is aware of everything that goes on around him, cares intensely about his family and about what others think of him. These traits are what got in the way of our accepting the diagnosis. And yet we have always known that there is something about him that is going to be one of the central issues of his life forever. It's not as easy to put your finger on it as you may have been lead to believe.

Through my son, I have met many other autistic children. They run a wide spectrum of behaviors and problems. Contrary to the image of a flat personality, I find these children to exhibit as wide a range as any group that size.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I seriously doubt that someone holding political office or a soldier or a school yard bully would suffer from autism.

I see no reason why not. I know of one young man who while not a bully is certainly bossy and overbearing.

Edit: Removed comments concerning Bill Gates. I doubt that he actually suffers from Asperger's.

 

[Kurdt]

There are many people in positions of authority that have been described as exhibiting symptoms of aspergers which is a relatively mild version of autism (at the bottom of the spectrum if you will). Certainly many who tend to exhibit what would be termed as eccentric behaviour get chalked up as having aspergers. How many of them actually do is not known to me and I'm not sure if there is an 'official' list of these people.

Anyway the point being its all about perceptions and when many people think of autism they think of the rainman film or more recently A Beautiful Mind.

 

[Mickey]

I'd like to see anyone watch this news story and try to claim that autistic individuals don't care about others.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-818944862742874918&q=autistic

 

[GCT]

There is one aspect that distinctively separates autistic children from all others...they lack a component of awareness; and it isn't too excessive to say that they have been deprived of consciousness, but perhaps not core consciousness.

There isn't too much of a problem with recognition, some have normal and even superior IQs, however it's almost as if they have much briefer periods of consciousness, or it's somehow relatively more intermitten. Extended consciousness is the main problem, it's a problem with integration of information for longer periods of time such as to suffice the world to become "real."

I've recently read upon some interesting research conducted by Dr. Geier, who is a respected scientist (MD) in his field, that is until recently when he started administering Lupron to Autistic children with the belief that it is testosterone which exacerbates the effects of mercury, which in some cases is believed to be the main etiological factor for autistic symptoms. I've talked with him briefly over email and it seems from some of the information he had sent me, and I haven't been able to understand whether he believes in any of the direct effects of testosterone on the brain, such as those that relate to the recent male brain hypothesis. I can somewhat see how the latter premise can directly contribute to autistic symptoms.

Imagine if you had the same hormonal influences at the age of 7 as when most of you probably went through such maturation during the normal age span...12-teens. Although Lupron is adminstered to castrate offenders it is also employed to treat precocious puberty. Not only are the physical changes brought on early, the mental effects are also onset, the testosterone levels are way higher then what is normal for these children's age (multiple times higher, I'm not quite sure if I can quote the source at this time, since the article copy he had given me ask that I not distribute it, so it seems that he has not published it fully at the moment). So a lot of these children spend most of their time masturbating (and after the eventual build up of irritation, proceed to endanger themselves in many ways, it's quite sad really) while they should be socializing and opening up to the world.

 

[Kurdt]

So basically this guy is saying the early release of testosterone has an effect on the brain of a child that causes the child to display autistic symptoms as the brain was not correctly prepared for the 'chemical assault' of testosterone at that age? Does he also say that the degree of autism depends on how much exposure the brain had? Hmm. I might be open to the testosterone theory but I'm not sure what masturbation has to do with it.

Anyway it would also explain why boys tend to have more autistic traits than girls I suppose.

 

[arildno]

It seems to me that these kids use masturbation as the most accessible form of self-healing (immediate tension-release).

That this alienates further from the "real world" and hence a continual build-up of frustration that must be released again is really saddening.

As I see it, what must be thought out and (taught them?) are other, more constructive and lasting forms of (self-)healing than masturbation.

 

[Kurdt]

Do not normal kids when they go through puberty masturbate? I don't get why it should be linked with autism or autistic traits (other than the fact that they have perhaps started puberty sooner).

 

[selfAdjoint]

Do not normal kids when they go through puberty masturbate? I don't get why it should be linked with autism or autistic traits (other than the fact that they have perhaps started puberty sooner).

For boys the old rule was "9 out of 10 guys masturbate and the tenth guy is a liar." Exceptions might be very unsocialized guys who just never realized - and never had any opportunity to learn - that it could be done. That would delay onset of masturbation a year or two.

 

[Kurdt]

For boys the old rule was "9 out of 10 guys masturbate and the tenth guy is a liar." Exceptions might be very unsocialized guys who just never realized - and never had any opportunity to learn - that it could be done. That would delay onset of masturbation a year or two.

Well that proves my point that most do it anyway but what I was trying to say is that it was implied that only people that have autism display this behaviour. Or at least that was the implication to me.

 

[GCT]

The mentioning of the masturbation was only in accordance with the topic of precocious puberty, it isn't intricately tied to autism directly. The testosterone levels were quite monstrous for the sample in the pertinent article. And they all display an interest in the female body...at the early age of 7, while most other children are concerned about contracting "cuties" (spelling?) from females and keeping them out of their treehouses. The thing about testosterone is that it takes the predominant role in onsetting some rapid changes as puberty starts, all teenagers deal with this period where physical changes and emotional desires are seemingly
of great importance.

By the way, selfadjoint, the rate is much lower then the statistic you've mentioned as it has been discovered more recently, it's closer to 50%, I'll quote the source later on today as I should really be getting to my research.

 

[Kurdt]

Ah ok seems I misunderstood you.

 

[arildno]

For boys the old rule was "9 out of 10 guys masturbate and the tenth guy is a liar."

Oh, I always thought the tenth did it more than he ought to. Hence his denial of the whole thing.

 

[selfAdjoint]

"cuties" (spelling?)

It was spelled Cooties where I grew up.

 

[Kurdt]

Ok I'm English so forgive the ignorance but just what the hell are cooties?

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

There is one aspect that distinctively separates autistic children from all others...they lack a component of awareness;

Which component? My son is aware of his surroundings. I have an anecdote that indicates that he knows more than he let's on. He only met my father after he (my father) was confined to a wheelchair. My son visited my father on many occasions, but never spoke to him or interacted with him other than to sit passively on his lap. When my son was 4, my father died. More than a year after the death, he saw the special needs access symbol on an elevator. It is a stylized depiction of a person in a wheelchair. My son pointed to it and said "grandpa". For this reason, I don't see any component of awareness that distinctively separates him from other children.

 

[Kurdt]

I agree with jimmy that autistic people are very much aware of the world around them but they choose not to let on about a lot of things that could lead to the conclusion that they seem unaware but its not the case.

I know people with aspergers which is the least inhibitive form of autism (I guess you could think of it like that) who will know something yet to socialise will actually ask a question to something they already know. They do this because already knowing it to them means they'd say nothing unless absolutely necessary (giving the illusion of unawareness) but allows some degree of social interaction.

Another way to look at it is to them the receiving of the information is pointless if they already know it and to a certain degree the conversation is pointless but it stimulates the interaction which they view as necessary to be part of whatever society.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

I know people with aspergers ... who will know something yet to socialise will actually ask a question to something they already know.

I have never seen this behavior in other autistic children, but it forms more than 90% of my son's conversation. My main window into what he is thinking and what is important to him is through these questions. His interests are sharply focused on minute details of obscure topics. For instance he knows far more about "haniwa" than most Japanese and will be extremely frustrated if he asks me a question about them and I don't know the answer (even though he does). The trick is to ferret out the inner boy by considering what lies below the surface of these questions.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

Ok I'm English so forgive the ignorance but just what the hell are cooties?

Cooties are a germ that little boys imagine they get by contact with little girls. There is no known cure for the germ, but puberty does wonders for the imagination.

 

[Kurdt]

Ah so its just the Lurgy then

Many of us Englards think its something real!

 

[Mickey]

Not to be rude, but did anyone check out this link?

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...918&q=autistic

It's a short video, but simply amazing. I don't want to spoil it for anyone.

 

[GCT]

Awareness pertains to extended consciousness, it isn't simply an ability to walk around and recognize random objects and people here and there. The child with autism may have core consciousness (I refer to these terms, with respect to Dr. Damasio's research and theories), they may even intellecutually realize their existence, but it's not fully realized. Extended consciousness is not necessarily directly correlated with intelligence, Damasio (from what I've read so far) mentions internal verbalization as being integral for extended consciousness, that is being able to carry out a stream of consciousness mode, which is natural for most people. It's not like one is playing chess at one time, and then the next thing that sparks realization is that one is in the classroom attending to the professor's lecture. People with normal consciousness are accountable to what's going on, autistic individuals don't since they have trouble integrating time mattered events because of a lack
of ongoing consciousness so that they can eventually develop a sense of self, or at least take up a time line of what is their life.

It is almost as if one were to get thorough half of their day, then at around, let's say 3 o'clock, they develop some amnesic symptoms,
or if their consciousness suddenly "shut off". How would this individual go about the rest of their day?

They would essentially feel lost, amnesic patients seek to regain their timeline, it is that important, thus even if they had lost this consciousness once, they have the inherent ability to redevelop it. However, even this requires a constant sense of what they're doing, one is seeking to reestablish "themselves." A constant consciousness of this fact and the ability to keep it in mind. Not much matters to an autistic mind, it is as if they never learn anything, they don't attain that level of flow in moving forward, and it seems that they can sense all of this, but aren't able to keep a level of consciousness to establish their lives. It may be that the child has a sense of this, in that everyone seems to be going somewhere. Thus they need a level of constancy to deal with the anxiety of what appears to be regression, because they can't take up a forward perspective of things. Reality becomes familiarity for the adequately consciousn mind, everything is novel for the autistic mind and everything is still going very fast. To them, their mind is what needs to be understood, that's perhaps the core consciousness, they can never "know" that they exist in a "real" world. A normal mind, understands this reality, that is if one were to experience nature in their own style (e.g hiking, camping, on the chair in the back porch with a view to a forested area) you wouldn't need any music, any emotion which spurs excitement, and any God to make the trees come alive, nothing else is needed.

 

[Kurdt]

I think perhaps most of this plays to the heavily autistic individual, but what about somebody with aspergers? I don't think they have no conscious mind nor do I think that people with extreme autistic tendancies have no conscious mind. They just lack certain abilities or compulsins to share things with others and so its very easy to draw conclusions such as they do not appear to be conscious.

I think from my aspergers experience that the break conscious streaming is very apparent but there is no lack of awareness just the inability to maintain a train of thought because it gets sidetracked. For example someone with aspergers may have 6 or 7 projects on the go when somebody else will have 2 or 3. this is because they can only work for maybe an hour at each before losing a train of thought. I'm not sure how this translates to people with more severe symptoms but I doubt they lose consciousness altogether.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

The child with autism may have core consciousness (I refer to these terms, with respect to Dr. Damasio's research and theories), they may even intellecutually realize their existence, but it's not fully realized.

Google "fully realized consciousness".

 

[arildno]

Extended consciousness is not necessarily directly correlated with intelligence, Damasio (from what I've read so far) mentions internal verbalization as being integral for extended consciousness, that is being able to carry out a stream of consciousness mode, which is natural for most people.. The child with autism may have core consciousness, they may even intellecutually realize their existence, but it's not fully realized

This is a fantasy of Dr. Damasio's.
He doesn't have access to anyone else's consciousness than his own, and is therefore merely speculating on what's going on, or not going on inside the autistic child's head.
Typical psychologist's pathologizing blah-blah.

 

[GCT]

Again, core consciousness v.s. extended consciousness...Damasio's theory.

 

[Mickey]

Alright, that link was to a video of a boy with autism who scored 20 points in 4 minutes in a high school basketball game.

How socially conscious do you have to be to do that? More than I've ever been. ;)

 

[Kurdt]

Well whatever basketball is I'm sure you don't have to be that socially aware to play at all, or indeed with any sport. Would you call all sportsmen autistic?

 

[Mickey]

Well whatever basketball is I'm sure you don't have to be that socially aware to play at all, or indeed with any sport. Would you call all sportsmen autistic?

Uh... that's an eerily smarmy question.

Basketball, if you've never heard of it, is a team sport. That means it requires some level of teamwork. And teamwork requires some level of social awareness.

You didn't watch the video. :/

I copied it wrong the second time, so here it is again:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-818944862742874918&q=autistic

 

[GCT]

arildno, I believe that Dr. Damasio has a good working hypothesis in explaining consciousness, ideas of what "consciousness" is has always been way out there so to speak, too abstract.

The topic of autism generates a wide spectrum of responses with regard to a sympathetic reaction, but the typical response with autistic individuals is to treat them on some retarded level, treat them as incapacitated and unfortunate and yet when one asks the question of whether they're conscious, the general attitutde is that they are. This establishes that some of these people have absolutely no basis in their opinions and are essentially clueless since they don't see the contradiction.

I've delved into psychology during my undergradute years a bit, and autism struck me as particularly interesting. Most people aren't able to graps the unfortunate aspect of autism, and its premise. If autistic individuals had consciousness, they would have some hope of integrating themselves into this world; to finally learn from past experiences for self maturation, and to then experience the world further for themselves. The fact that some have normal or even superior IQs, and yet will not see the world any differently from an early age till the day they die explains that problem of autism has to do with a fundamental deprivation of consciousness, which most people aren't able to acknoweldge nor wish to do so. They were born into a world, and they'll leave without knowing it.

Autistic individuals can interact with the world, such as being able to play sports systematically, but they'll never see it as real. That is, not much really matters to an autistic mind, the fact that even they have a future to prepare for. Mental retardation itself has to do with deficiency in the ability to perform on intellectual tasks. What distinguishes autism, is the social deficiency, however it is also the inability to integrate information over lengths of time, even if they can maintain themselves through a basketball game (certainly not the whole basketball game, in reference to the video Mickey has mentioned) they won't get anything out of it, to grow from the experience. There's no process of maturation, everything becomes cut short. Autistic individuals can understand threats on some level, but as all of you may know, this merely requires a moment of identification and a slight sense of urgency in the protocol of what one is supposed to do. One might, let's say feel a bit nervous speaking in front of public, there's a general urgency of a "threat," however, one will need to become aware of their environment and their appearance throughout the speech, so they have to constantly monitor themselves (an example of extended consciousness). One can always see the threat, however, if there's no awareness of things, then what results is debilitation. Damasio may not agree with defining "awareness" in this context, he probably sees it has much more simple mechanism.

 

[Kurdt]

Uh... that's an eerily smarmy question.

Basketball, if you've never heard of it, is a team sport. That means it requires some level of teamwork. And teamwork requires some level of social awareness.

You didn't watch the video. :/

I copied it wrong the second time, so here it is again:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-818944862742874918&q=autistic

Dude I was just jesting. Anyway my point was that you don't have to be socially integrated with the members of a team to perform well on the pitch or court or whatever you're playing. I was a member of a football team for many years and was socially excluded from the others but I could still play well with them on the pitch. I was just thinking perhaps there is something about the rules of engagement for sport which make it easier for autistic people. That or just the fact that he's damned good allows the others to be more tolerant of his eccentricities off the court.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

arildno, I believe that Dr. Damasio has a good working hypothesis in explaining consciousness, ideas of what "consciousness" is has always been way out there so to speak, too abstract.

There's a good reason for those ideas being abstract. Does Dr. Damasio provide concrete metrics?

I see my son's lack of social skills as a symptom of his autism, not the autism itself. I see autism as an neurological disorder, not a psychological one. It seems that all the signals reach the brain, but the brain has trouble to sort signal from noise. This goes by the name "sensory integrative disfunction". Examples of signal to noise issues are:

Some react negatively to touch, sound, and other sensory input as if they were reacting to unpleasant noise.
Some repeat motions, as if to increase signal over noise.
Some are soothed by being stroked in a single direction rather than back and forth, similar to repetitive motion.

I don't think that spurious signals are created in the brain, as would be the case in a psychiatric or psychological disorder.

 

[GCT]

Yes, autism is more fundamental then psychological disorders. There may be a lot of validity in the issue you've raised regarding signal to noise, however, autistic children's minds are usually in a constant state, despite their environment. So even though they may be in an empty room, it appears that they are still preoccupied with sensing these "signals" when most would undersatnd that there's nothing really there to begin with, no stimuli in any form, except for those generated by their own agendas, they're trapped in their own world (to a lesser or greater extent). This suggests to me that their minds are fundamentally disconnected, although not totally, there's no appreciation for the consciousness, so I don't believe that it is due to them being feeble minded which means that normal interactions are too much for them. There's an immediate mis-interpretation, without any prior appropriate and adequate sensing of the situation. They are not really sensing anything, the situation becomes assessed as threatening without any experience. Their experience is fundamentally different from a mind with a normal level of consciousness, it's totally without any external basis.

Most people cannot point out what exactly is it that makes autism what it is, besides the apparent lack of social interest, even with mental retardation it is an issue with IQ, it can be understood more directly, but it is undeniable that there is a lack of component of something with people with autism but it is less tangible. I believe that it is an incapacity for consciousness in general, that is something that is much more base.

One might say that the etiology is in the mechanics of the system, such as the topic of signal/noise, however, I believe that there's something that connects the human mind directly with the environment, this seems to be what we can essentially deem as consciousness, it is the why in reality. And I believe that autism is a particular case where a great aspect of consciousness has been denied to the individual's mind. Autistic minds are conscious, they can sense themselves, and their near proximity, it is as if they're trapped inside of their own minds however, which is what makes the disorder truly poignant. I don't believe that there's a mechanism that can be isolated, or even a couple of mechanisms to dispel the autistic symptoms, as you've said it's grossly neurological.

 

[Mickey]

Sorry, Kurdt, I didn't know if you were a foreigner or something.

The video clearly shows that this boy is into basketball. He's motivated by it. He supported his team off the court through the season, and because of that support, he got his chance to suit up, and then he stepped up to the opportunity. He knew when he was "on fire" and "hot as a pistol."

Autistic individuals appear to have the potential for very exclusive interests. The social world doesn't interest them, so their behavior doesn't change as a result, but allow them the freedom to follow their interest, and draw out detailed architectural plans for an imaginary city or some other thing, and they go for it. Of course, their interests may not always be that newsworthy, but if they can be so specific than perhaps they are very difficult to recognize and engage.

They don't have to be savants or socially competent to have potential to be passionate about something.Also, I've read some Damasio (Descartes' Error and The Feeling of What Happens), and I think he has, for the moment, too much of a medicinal bias. In all the talk about consciousness pathology, he seems to get carried away and forget or ignore just how diverse the healthy population is. I suppose it's just a sign of the infancy of consciousness science, that he must rely on the sick in order to create a model of the healthy.

It's a good sign that cheaper and more prevalent non-invasive scanning technologies are giving us a broader approach.

 

[Kurdt]

It is interesting to note that many individuals with high functioning autism or aspergers are professional in the field of mathematics and physics. This means that barring those with the most severe symptoms autistic people of course have the capability of integrating into society. I believe it is just the ignorance and intolerance of other individuals that hold a lot of other quite capable autistic indiciduals back. Like Mickey says if they are given the right support and encouragement they should excel whether or not the social side with others is fulfilled and others should see the positive contribution and respect the fact that social things may make the autistic person uncomfortable. I certainly do not subscribe to these consciousness theories of Damasio as in my experience they seem wildly unfounded.

 

[GCT]

no, the main symptom of autism is that they do not come out of their world or that they aren't able to consciously sense the world with nearly the same capacity as normally functioning individuals. The disorder isn't due to environmental stressors. And there are no autistic or asperger individuals who are independently mathematicians or physicists.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

there are no autistic or asperger individuals who are independently mathematicians or physicists.

How could you know that?

 

[Pythagorean]

There is one aspect that distinctively separates autistic children from all others...they lack a component of awareness; and it isn't too excessive to say that they have been deprived of consciousness, but perhaps not core consciousness.

There isn't too much of a problem with recognition, some have normal and even superior IQs, however it's almost as if they have much briefer periods of consciousness, or it's somehow relatively more intermitten. Extended consciousness is the main problem, it's a problem with integration of information for longer periods of time such as to suffice the world to become "real."

Before I pose my questin, let me tell you what conceptual layment understanding I have of the brain. It comes from a book "The Brains of Men and Machines" that basically explains how the brain works in terms of a computer so that an electrical engineer can understand it. (It's basically an A.I. book).

In it, the author describes basically a grid of operating centers. The x-axis of the grid represents the three different types of brain 'operations': input (sensory), computation (goal selection), and output (motor control). And the y-axis of the grid represents the different levels. So a single brain can compute sensory, decisions, and actions on several different levels, and that's the basic heirarchy of the 'operating system' in the brain.

Is what you're referring to, by consciousness, the higher of the goal selection or sensory input, or the higher functions in general?

If this concept of the brain is correct, could you explain autism in these terms?

 

[Kurdt]

I know of at least one physicist with aspergers syndrome. I also remember reading a study about the careers that aspergers sufferers most often chose to go into and at the top was mathematics then physics. If I find the study I will post the link but it was a few years ago that I saw it.

 

[arildno]

Well, all I hear is so many glib (and derogatory) statements that autists don't care about their social world or that they have more of an animal consciousness than a fully mature human consciousness.

What if autists are in grip of a paralyzing dread for the "outer" world, so that they simply don't dare to interact with it OTHER THAN IN WAYS THAT SEEM COMPLETELY SAFE TO THEM?
That is, why should we think their basic mental faculties are impaired in any way whatsoever, and that, rather, the reason why they don't seem to learn much, is that they don't dare to learn?


IMO, such a dread can explain much of those features with autists that often is regarded as "puzzling" with them:
1. That they seem perfectly able to learn difficult arcana
2. That they often can show a passionate attachment to SOME persons (typically in their families).

Furthermore, I believe such a dread perfectly well might have a neurological basis (and not at all the result of a "bad" upbringing).

To give one way of thinking of this:
It is certainly advantageous for any creature to be somewhat wary of their surroundings.
After all, dangers lurk about, and to have one wits about oneself is crucial.

However, equally important, is that events that repeat without harm, or environments that do not over time display danger signals, those events ought to instill in us a TRUST that they are, in fact, safe. Otherwise, our mind becomes fruitlessly wasted on non-existing dangers (rather than used for joy-seeking, or avoidance of REAL dangers).


What would happen to a creature or child if that experience-based instilment of trust went awry?
Wouldn't it sort of live in perpetual terror?

For example, wouldn't it then be paramount to you to try to recreate precisely those few situations that earlier showed themselves to be safe?
That is, wouldn't it be logical and natural to engage in behaviour that for the outsider seems obsessively repetitive and ritualistic?

From this perspective, one might regard autists as having the FULL HUMAN RANGE of emotions desires and mental capabilities, but that they are placed in an unenviable situation of constantly having to fight for mental composure and the sense of security we "normals" take for granted.
If we ever were to be placed in their situation, we would behave exactly like they do:
Try as best we can to gain that level of personal confidence and security that would allow us to go on with our lives to new experiences. (Alternatively, if the dread becomes overpowering, we'll huddle in a corner)

Just my two cents..

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

What if autists are in grip of a paralyzing dread for the "outer" world, so that they simply don't dare to interact with it OTHER THAN IN WAYS THAT SEEM COMPLETELY SAFE TO THEM?

You are describing a psychological problem (dread). If the brain has trouble sorting out pleasant stimuli from irritating noise, then a certain dread of ordinary contact may result. This is a symptom, not the disease.
A lot of treatment for autism concentrates on the symptoms. I expect this is because a) they are easy to identify and b) they are distressing to the family. In my opinion however, it would be better to work on the disease itself. My policy is to reinforce signal in order to create pathways in the brain. For example: Stroking in the same direction, not back and forth. Singing rounds. Repeating stock answers to stock questions. Providing chewing gum.

 

[arildno]

Well, as I see it, dread would be the natural psychological response to a fault in the habituation chemistry&neurology of the brain:

In habit-formation, we essentially slacken our attention and relax, and free our mind to occupy ourselves with other stuff, for example learning new stuff.
If, for example. we had the need to pay complete attention to every deed we do, every perception we recieve, every word we utter, we would really be able to accomplish practically nothing!
We NEED habits in order to learn other things, or interact with the world in fruitful ways.

However, since habituation first and foremost is to "let go" and not to pay attention to what one is doing, it is integrally related to having a "trust" in that it is safe for us to do so. We need not remain on guard.


On a neorological/chemical level, that habituation feature may well be connected with specific regulatory proteins or in how synapses are made.(We gain a signal that "we know this/it's safe")
Possibly, once neuro-chemistry becomes more advanced, it might be possible to develop a medication that ease the formation of synapses and habituation to and trust in the world around.

I do not see any theoretical need for regarding autists as being primarily defective in cognitive or emotional capabilities.

(Also note that the main difference between enacting a ritual and doing something by habit is that when enacting a ritual we expend immense attention to it in order to get every detail right, whereas actions by habit are only half-attended to, and it doesn't matter too much if it the result turns out slightly different than before. A ritual, however, has failed if we do not exactly reproduce its previous instantiation).


Your strategy seems to optimize habit-formation, or create (and maintain!) pathways in the brain, as you said it. I think it makes a lot of sense.

 

[larkspur]

New study reguarding Autism

http://www.cnn.com/2006/HEALTH/09/04/autism.dads.age.ap/index.html"

Men who become fathers in their 40s or older are much more likely to have autistic children than younger dads, a new study released Monday shows, bolstering evidence that genetics contributes to the mental disorder.

 

[Evo]

Interesting article larkspur! I wonder what further studies will show?