Classical and modern differential geometry

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the study of classical and modern differential geometry, particularly focusing on the differential geometry of curves and surfaces in three-dimensional Euclidean space, as well as the transition to more abstract concepts in modern differential geometry. Participants seek recommendations for textbooks or lecture notes that cover both classical and modern topics simultaneously.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant outlines a course on classical differential geometry, mentioning key topics such as mean curvature, Gaussian curvature, and geodesics, and seeks resources that also cover modern differential geometry.
  • Another participant suggests searching for resources and mentions a book by Isham focused on coordinate-free differential geometry, indicating there may be more recent publications available.
  • Several participants recommend specific textbooks, including Millman & Parker's "Elements of Differential Geometry," Wolfgang Kühnel's "Differential Geometry: Curves - Surfaces - Manifolds," and R. W. R. Darling's "Differential Forms and Connections," noting their relevance to the discussion.
  • One participant expresses interest in the application of differential geometry to quantum field theory (QFT) and electromagnetism, mentioning the concept of fiber bundles and their significance in these areas.
  • Another participant emphasizes the importance of learning the differential geometry of curves and surfaces before transitioning to manifolds, arguing that the mathematical techniques differ significantly and that the former provides essential intuition.
  • A participant acknowledges their background in topology, suggesting they are less concerned about the abstraction in modern differential geometry while still considering the advice about learning order.
  • Additional recommendations include Frankel's "The Geometry of Physics" and Schutz's "Geometrical Methods of Mathematical Physics," highlighting their pedagogical approaches and relevance to gauge theory.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on whether it is advisable to study classical and modern differential geometry simultaneously. Some argue for a sequential approach to build intuition, while others believe that prior knowledge in topology may allow for simultaneous study without significant issues.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the mathematical techniques for classical differential geometry (curves and surfaces) and modern differential geometry (manifolds) are significantly different, which may affect the learning process. There is also mention of varying levels of abstraction and intuition required for each area.

vancouver_water
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Im planning on taking a course on classical differential geometry next term. This is the outline:
The differential geometry of curves and surfaces in three-dimensional Euclidean space. Mean curvature and Gaussian curvature. Geodesics. Gauss's Theorema Egregium.
The textbook is "differential geometry of curves and surfaces" by do carmo.

I was wondering if anyone knows a good textbook or set of lecture notes that covers this material and modern differential geometry at the same time. Ideally i will work from this textbook for the class and learn the same ideas in modern differential geometry at the same time. Thanks!
 
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Have you tried a google search?

I found a book by Isham for graduate physics students. It was pub in 1989 from a collection of course notes on coordinate free differential geometry.

There must be more recent publications.

I also found one on DDG for computer work.

What topics of DG are you interested in?
 
jedishrfu said:
Have you tried a google search?

I found a book by Isham for graduate physics students. It was pub in 1989 from a collection of course notes on coordinate free differential geometry.

There must be more recent publications.

I also found one on DDG for computer work.

What topics of DG are you interested in?
I'm mostly interested in how it can be applied to QFT and electromagnetism. I've seen the phrase fibre bundle come up a lot. But I also like DG just for the subject itself. Atleast I liked the section on curves and surfaces that I learned about in my calc course.
 
Daverz said:
Millman & Parker, Elements of Differential Geometry

https://www.amazon.com/dp/0132641437/?tag=pfamazon01-20

The last chapter covers manifolds.

Wolfgang Kühnel, Differential Geometry: Curves - Surfaces - Manifolds

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0821839888/?tag=pfamazon01-20

See my comments on Amazon.

And somewhat more eccentric and with a different emphasis:

R. W. R. Darling, Differential Forms and Connections

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0521468000/?tag=pfamazon01-20

Thanks for the reference, the one by Millman and Parker seems to be quite close to what I'm looking for.
 
vancouver_water said:
I'm mostly interested in how it can be applied to QFT and electromagnetism. I've seen the phrase fibre bundle come up a lot. But I also like DG just for the subject itself. Atleast I liked the section on curves and surfaces that I learned about in my calc course.

The Darling book and Frankel below would be the most relevant to gauge theory.

A couple I forgot:

Frankel, The Geometry of Physics

This has everything you need worked out with pedagogical care, but it's not a quick read.

Schutz, Geometrical Methods of Mathematical Physics

Good on the basics and an easy read, but not much on fiber bundles.


 
"Differential Geometry of Curves and Surfaces", by Manfredo do Carmo, is great as an introduction to DG because DG should start with the study of curves and surfaces in 3D before going into the geometry of n-dimensional differential manifolds.

If you want to go further then you can use two books

(1) "An Introduction to Manifolds" by Loring Tu. Chapters 1 through 6 make the transition to the differential geometry of manifolds up to Stokes's theorem on manifolds. In my opinion, it's a good idea to read the second book and learn some algebraic topology before reading chapter 7.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1441973990/?tag=pfamazon01-20

(2) "Riemannian Geometry" by Manfredo do Carmo. This book builds upon the knowledge from the previous book and focuses on the study of distance and curvature on manifolds.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0817634908/?tag=pfamazon01-20

A good alternative to these two books is "An Introduction to Differentiable Manifolds and Riemannian Geometry" by William Boothby, but it seems that it is more popular with mathematicians than it is with students.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0121160513/?tag=pfamazon01-20
 
vancouver_water said:
I was wondering if anyone knows a good textbook or set of lecture notes that covers this material and modern differential geometry at the same time.

I must add that "at the same time" is not a good idea. DG of curves and surfaces works in R^3. DG of manifolds works on topological spaces that, locally, look like R^n. The mathematical techniques to deal with each situation are significantly different. And I think it's much better to learn DG of curves and surfaces before learning DG on manifolds because the latter can easily get away from our intuition without the former.
 
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FourEyedRaven said:
I must add that "at the same time" is not a good idea. DG of curves and surfaces works in R^3. DG of manifolds works on topological spaces that, locally, look like R^n. The mathematical techniques to deal with each situation are significantly different. And I think it's much better to learn DG of curves and surfaces before learning DG on manifolds because the latter can easily get away from our intuition without the former.

Thanks for the book reference. As for learning both at the same time, i wasnt too worried about the techniques and abstraction in modern dg since I have already studied topology. But thanks for the suggestion, ill keep it in mind.
 
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vancouver_water said:
I'm mostly interested in how it can be applied to QFT and electromagnetism. I've seen the phrase fibre bundle come up a lot. But I also like DG just for the subject itself. Atleast I liked the section on curves and surfaces that I learned about in my calc course.

I like (end of each chapter summarizes the abstract notation and the useful coordinate-based expressions)
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0521187966/?tag=pfamazon01-20
Differential Geometry and Lie Groups for Physicists
by Marián Fecko

A standard book for physicists is
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0750306068/?tag=pfamazon01-20
Geometry, Topology and Physics (Graduate Student Series in Physics) 2nd Edition
by Mikio Nakahara
 

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