Confusion about the Strain Energy when loading/unloading a sample

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of strain energy in the context of loading and unloading a sample. Participants explore the definitions and interpretations of work done on and by the sample, particularly focusing on the area under the loading curve and its implications for energy transfer during these processes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the area under the loading curve represents the work done on the sample, as it involves applying force to the sample.
  • Others argue that the work done by the sample during unloading should be considered, as the force exerted by the sample is directed toward its surroundings.
  • A participant suggests that the work done on the sample is negative during unloading, as the applied force opposes the displacement.
  • There is a proposal that the area under the loading curve can be divided into components: work done on the sample, work done by the sample, and energy lost.
  • Some participants express confusion regarding the terminology of work done "on" versus "by" the sample, suggesting that it may be more useful to consider the overall energy dynamics of the system.
  • A comparison is made to a trampoline, where the work done by the trampoline is likened to the work done by the sample when it returns to its equilibrium position.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on whether the area under the loading curve represents work done on or by the sample, indicating multiple competing views and ongoing debate regarding the interpretation of these concepts.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the definitions of work done on and by the sample, and how these relate to energy input and output during loading and unloading. The discussion highlights the complexity of interpreting strain energy and the associated terminology.

KevMilan
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The answer says B, it does makes sense, but why D is regarded as incorrect. If the Elastic Potential energy when loading is the area under the loading curve, so why not with the unloading?
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D is the work done by the sample while unloading.
 
What about the area under the loading curve? Is it the workdone on the sample or by the sample?
 
KevMilan said:
What about the area under the loading curve? Is it the workdone on the sample or by the sample?
Like I said, it is the work done by the sample. The force exerted by the sample on its surroundings is directed toward the sample, and the displacement at the boundary where the work is being done is directed toward the sample. So the work done by the sample is positive. The work done on the sample is negative.
 
For the area under the loading curve, shouldn't it be the workdone ON the sample? Because we are the one putting force/stress on it? Could you clarify? Thankyou.
 
KevMilan said:
For the area under the loading curve, shouldn't it be the workdone ON the sample?
Because we are the one putting force/stress on it? Could you clarify? Thankyou.
Yes. The force we apply and the displacement are in the same direction.
 
KevMilan said:
What about the area under the loading curve? Is it the workdone on the sample or by the sample?
Work done ON the sample, but that area is the sum of the shaded area and the "white" sliver.
Area under top line = work done on the sample, Energy Input
Shaded area = = work done BY the sample when unloaded - Energy returned
The white sliver represents in Energy Lost (Put in, but not returned, ie Option A).
 
One more thing, why is it the workdone BY the sample (not ON)? (Is it because we're not putting any force/tension on the sample when unloading?) Any simple explanation would be very helpful!
 
KevMilan said:
One more thing, why is it the workdone BY the sample (not ON)? (Is it because we're not putting any force/tension on the sample when unloading?) Any simple explanation would be very helpful!

I suspect you would get similar load/unload curves for a trampoline, and I am happy to consider that the trampoline is doing work on me (work done by the trampoline) when it is flinging me back into the air after I have jumped on it and pushed the mat down (I did work on the Trampoline).
 
  • #10
I see. Thanks a lot man [emoji106]
 
  • #11
KevMilan said:
One more thing, why is it the workdone BY the sample (not ON)? (Is it because we're not putting any force/tension on the sample when unloading?)
We are applying a force on the sample during unloading. But that force is opposite to the displacement so we are doing negative work. If you interpret the dark area as negative, then it represents the work done ON the sample during unloading.
 
  • #12
KevMilan said:
One more thing, why is it the workdone BY the sample (not ON)?
'On' or 'By' is not necessarily obvious and it's actually a bit anthropomorphic, imo.
It may be better to think in terms of the system as a whole and whether energy is being put in or taken out. During displacement from the equilibrium position, Energy is put in (the direction of the arrow on the diagram is an indication of this). As the system returns to equilibrium position, Energy is taken out.
 

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