Electrical grounding and alternating current

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of electrical grounding in relation to alternating current (AC) in household wiring. Participants explore the implications of AC on current flow to ground, the safety mechanisms involved, and the nature of grounding as a source or sink for electrons.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions how current can flow to ground with alternating current, arguing that there is no net movement of charge.
  • Another participant challenges this view by using an analogy of a swing, suggesting that alternating motion can still result in an impact.
  • A third participant provides a link to a resource discussing AC wiring practices and safety, indicating a focus on understanding the function of grounding.
  • Further clarification is offered regarding the Earth wire's role, stating that it alternates between carrying current away from and back to a faulty appliance.
  • Another participant expresses confusion over the terminology used, noting that individual electrons in AC only move back and forth slightly, questioning the notion of current being "carried" in a traditional sense.
  • One participant asserts that earthing is primarily for equipment protection rather than for providing a return path for current.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of current flow in AC systems and the role of grounding. There is no consensus on the implications of alternating current for grounding practices, and the discussion remains unresolved.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference various interpretations of grounding and current flow, highlighting potential ambiguities in terminology and understanding of AC behavior. The discussion reflects differing perspectives on the safety and functionality of grounding in electrical systems.

Jimmy87
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When households are said to be grounded using an Earth wire, electrons are supposed to flow to the ground because the ground is at zero volts. For example, if your the live wire touches the metal casing of your toaster then the Earth wire takes the current to ground. But isn't a lot of household current alternating? Therefore, how would current flow to ground because with alternating current there is no net movement of charge?

With another example, what would specifically kill you if your feet were on the ground but your hands were touching an overhead cable (you would need to be tall I know). Again, no charge would flow through you specifically as it would be alternating. Would it be the ions in your body which kill you as they would be shaking back and forth due to the alternating voltage?

Also, why is the ground considered to be a source or sink for electrons - wouldn't the ground have to be a conductor to have free electrons?

Thank you for any help!
 
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Jimmy87 said:
Therefore, how would current flow to ground because with alternating current there is no net movement of charge?
I'm not sure why you think that is true, but suppose child is playing on a swing, and you step in front of the swing so it hits you. Would you argue that you won't get hurt by the impact, because there is no net movement of the swing, it only alternates between one direction and the other?
 
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An excellent discussion of AC wiring practices, and the function of each wire - the focus is on safety:
http://amasci.com/amateur/whygnd.html

Ask if you have further questions after studying this.
 
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AlephZero said:
I'm not sure why you think that is true, but suppose child is playing on a swing, and you step in front of the swing so it hits you. Would you argue that you won't get hurt by the impact, because there is no net movement of the swing, it only alternates between one direction and the other?

Thanks for the replies. From books I have read they say that there is no net movement of electrons in a wire carrying alternating current, therefore how can an Earth wire carry current away from a faulty appliance in the house?
 
OK, maybe the use of language isn't very precise and that is confusing you. Half the time, the Earth wire is carrying current away from the faulty appliance. The other half of the time, it is carrying current back to the appliance.

Actually, even the idea of "carrying current" is misleading, because individual electrons in the wire only move back and forth by a few millimeters at most. Nothing physically moves from the appliance all the way to the ground and back again, 50 or 60 times a second. When the appliance is working normally, nothing moves all the way from the power station to your house either.
 
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AlephZero said:
Half the time, the Earth wire is carrying current away from the faulty appliance. The other half of the time, it is carrying current back to the appliance.

i have read that earthing is done not for return path of current,but only for protection of equipments.
"carrying current back to appliance" is done in grounding!
 

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