I Entropy and organized systems

[TheusMX]

If the entropy of the universe always increases, how is it possible for organized systems like life to exist? Shouldn't the natural tendency always be toward disorder and chaos? I'm confused about how this law applies to biological systems.

 

[anuttarasammyak]

Dissipation structure is an answer. In order the Earth including the lives evloves, the Sun provides energy. Entropy of the system decrease thanks to energy dissipation, which ends with entropy increase in the total system.

 

[Dale]

I'm confused about how this law applies to biological systems.

The same as for any other system.

How do you think ice crystals form?

 

[Demystifier]

If the entropy of the universe always increases, how is it possible for organized systems like life to exist? Shouldn't the natural tendency always be toward disorder and chaos? I'm confused about how this law applies to biological systems.

The answer is illustrated by the following pictures:

Organized systems correspond to states with high complexity, where entropy is neither too big nor too small. See also the Appendix in my https://arxiv.org/abs/1703.08341

 

[Chestermiller]

The local entropy per unit mass varies with spatial position in the universe. If the entropy decreases in one region, the entropy in the rest of the universe must increase by a greater amount.

 

[DaveE]

Maybe this video will help:

 

[jbriggs444]

The answer is illustrated by the following pictures:
View attachment 357476

How are you measuring complexity?

The claim that a fully mixed container of milk and Coke has lower complexity than a partially mixed container? Presumably because you consider "fully mixed" to be a simple to describe macro-state despite requiring a vast quantity of information to completely describe a particular microstate. I am pretty sure that there is a broken definition lurking in there.

 

[Demystifier]

How are you measuring complexity?

The claim that a fully mixed container of milk and Coke has lower complexity than a partially mixed container? Presumably because you consider "fully mixed" to be a simple to describe macro-state despite requiring a vast quantity of information to completely describe a particular microstate. I am pretty sure that there is a broken definition lurking in there.

Complexity is hard to define precisely. For some approaches see e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Measures_of_complexity

 

[jbriggs444]

Complexity is hard to define precisely. For some approaches see e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Measures_of_complexity

And there it is. Indeed, one possible definition is broken.

Effective complexity is a measure of complexity defined in a 1996 paper by Murray Gell-Mann and Seth Lloyd that attempts to measure the amount of non-random information in a system.[1][2] It has been criticised as being dependent on the subjective decisions made as to which parts of the information in the system are to be discounted as random.[3]

[emphasis mine]