Graphing Derivatives: How to Find Maxima, Minima, and Points of Inflection

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around graphing derivatives to identify maxima, minima, and points of inflection for the function \( f(y) = y^3 + 3y^2 + 3y + 2 \). Participants are analyzing the first and second derivatives to understand the behavior of the function.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants attempt to derive the first and second derivatives and discuss their implications for identifying critical points and inflection points. Questions arise regarding the interpretation of results, particularly concerning the behavior of the function around \( y = -1 \) and how to determine local maxima or minima when the second derivative is zero.

Discussion Status

The discussion includes various interpretations of the derivatives and their implications. Some participants suggest alternative approaches to clarify the results, while others express uncertainty about the interpretation of specific points and the behavior of the function in different regions.

Contextual Notes

Participants note that the function exhibits different behaviors in regions defined by the critical point \( y = -1 \), leading to discussions about convexity and concavity. There is also mention of the potential for confusion regarding the representation of axes in graphing.

Karol
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Homework Statement


Snap1.jpg

Only 15

Homework Equations


First derivative=maxima/minima/vertical tangent/rising/falling
Second derivative=points of inflection/concave upward-downward

The Attempt at a Solution


$$x=y^3+3y^2+3y+2~\rightarrow~1=3(y^2+2y+1)y'$$
$$y'=\frac{1}{3(y+1)^2}>0,~y\neq (-1),~y=(-1)\rightarrow~x=-1$$
So the vertical tangent is at x=(-1)
The second derivative:
$$y"=(-2)\frac{y+1}{3(y^2+2y+1)(y+1)^2}=\left( -\frac{2}{3} \right)\frac{1}{(y+1)^3}$$
The answer, i don't know exactly how to interpret it, is (1,-1)
 
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Karol said:

Homework Statement


View attachment 212347
Only 15

Homework Equations


First derivative=maxima/minima/vertical tangent/rising/falling
Second derivative=points of inflection/concave upward-downward

The Attempt at a Solution


$$x=y^3+3y^2+3y+2~\rightarrow~1=3(y^2+2y+1)y'$$
$$y'=\frac{1}{3(y+1)^2}>0,~y\neq (-1),~y=(-1)\rightarrow~x=-1$$
So the vertical tangent is at x=(-1)
The second derivative:
$$y"=(-2)\frac{y+1}{3(y^2+2y+1)(y+1)^2}=\left( -\frac{2}{3} \right)\frac{1}{(y+1)^3}$$
The answer, i don't know exactly how to interpret it, is (1,-1)

For ##y = -1## we have ##x = +1##, not ##x = -1##.

In the region ##y > 0## the function ##f(y) = y^3 + 3 y^2 + 3y + 2## is (strictly) convex, but for ##y < 0## it has mixed behavior: strictly convex for ##y >-1## and strictly concave for ##y < -1##. Here, the modern terminology "convex" is what older introductory calculus books call "concave up", while "concave" is new-speak for "concave down".

The value ##y=-1## is a stationary point of ##f(y)## (derivative = 0), and is also an inflection point (second derivative = 0).

See, eg., https://mjo.osborne.economics.utoronto.ca/index.php/tutorial/index/1/cv1/t
or
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ConvexFunction.html
regarding terminology.
 
Karol said:

Homework Statement


View attachment 212347
Only 15

Homework Equations


First derivative=maxima/minima/vertical tangent/rising/falling
Second derivative=points of inflection/concave upward-downward

The Attempt at a Solution


$$x=y^3+3y^2+3y+2~\rightarrow~1=3(y^2+2y+1)y'$$
$$y'=\frac{1}{3(y+1)^2}>0,~y\neq (-1),~y=(-1)\rightarrow~x=-1$$
So the vertical tangent is at x=(-1)
The second derivative:
$$y"=(-2)\frac{y+1}{3(y^2+2y+1)(y+1)^2}=\left( -\frac{2}{3} \right)\frac{1}{(y+1)^3}$$
The answer, i don't know exactly how to interpret it, is (1,-1)
I assume that in taking the second derivative you are trying to determine whether the arc lies to the left or the right of the tangent.
You might find it easier to swap x and y and ask whether it is a local maximum or local minimum. How do you resolvethat when the second derivative is zero?
 
$$f(y) = y^3 + 3 y^2 + 3y + 2~\rightarrow~y'=3(y+1)^2,~y'=0~\rightarrow~x=(-1)$$
$$y(-1)~\rightarrow~x=(-1)$$
The y'=0 line that is parallel to the y-axis is vertical to the x.
The graph is:
15.png
 
Correction:
15.png
 
No, thank you Ray and Haruspex
 
I think your calculations might have been easier and your result more obvious to you, related perhaps to something already familiar or known, perhaps all visible in a trice rather than the forgettable result of a slog if you had rewritten 15 as
$$x=\left( y+1\right) ^{3}+1$$
Nowhere is there any law btw forcing people to always portray x as horizontal and y as vertical!
 
Last edited:

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