How does the theory of relativity affect our understanding of temperature?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the implications of the theory of relativity on the understanding of temperature, particularly in the context of special relativity (SR) and relativistic thermodynamics. Participants explore how temperature might change for objects moving at relativistic speeds and the theoretical frameworks that address these changes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that temperature is a measure of the average motion of particles and questions whether the temperature of an object moving at relativistic speeds would be higher than its rest temperature, proposing a formula involving the Lorentz factor (gamma).
  • Another participant notes that relativistic thermodynamics is controversial, indicating that temperature may "dilate," "contract," or remain unchanged depending on the reference frame from which it is measured, and references Tolman's work as a resource.
  • A different participant mentions a paper on van-Kampen Israel theory, which introduces a four-vector representation of "inverse temperature," suggesting a more complex treatment of thermodynamics in relativistic contexts.
  • One participant raises the idea that temperature might be related to the blue-shift/red-shift phenomenon, questioning how temperature appears to change based on the motion of the observer.
  • Another participant recommends a book by Richard C. Tolman on relativity and thermodynamics, noting its historical context and relevance to the discussion.
  • One participant expresses uncertainty about the relationship between temperature and fast-moving objects, mentioning that an accelerating observer perceives their surroundings as hotter than a non-accelerating observer, and references further reading on relativistic heat conduction.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a variety of viewpoints regarding the relationship between temperature and relativistic effects, with no consensus reached. The discussion includes competing theories and interpretations, highlighting the complexity and ongoing debate in the field.

Contextual Notes

Participants acknowledge limitations in their understanding of thermodynamics and the nuances of relativistic effects on temperature. The discussion also touches on unresolved mathematical steps and the dependence on specific definitions within relativistic thermodynamics.

blumfeld0
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As I understand it, temperature is really a measure of the average motion of particles. In SR when an object is going at a speed appreciable to the speed of light it will be time dilated, length contracted etc.
But what if we were to measure its temperature; since it is going a lot faster won't its temperature be much larger (hotter) compared to its rest temperature?
Is there a formula for this?
is it just that T'= Trest*gamma where gamma is just (1-v^2/c^2)^(-1/2)?

thank you
 
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blumfeld0 said:
As I understand it, temperature is really a measure of the average motion of particles. In SR when an object is going at a speed appreciable to the speed of light it will be time dilated, length contracted etc.
But what if we were to measure its temperature; since it is going a lot faster won't its temperature be much larger (hotter) compared to its rest temperature?
Is there a formula for this?
is it just that T'= Trest*gamma where gamma is just (1-v^2/c^2)^(-1/2)?

Relativistic thermodynamics is one of the most controversial chapters of relativity. Depending on the conditions in which heat is transmitted, you can find that T "dilates" or "contracts" or does not change at all when we detect it from different inertial reference frames in relative motion. Because entropy is an invariant it is considered that heat transforms in the same way as temperature does. Tolman's well known treatise is a good tool to start. I will send you a link.
sine ira et studio
 
You might try looking at http://arxiv.org/abs/physics/0505004

It presents a particular version of relativistic thermo called van-Kampen Israel theory, but it has some links to other papers.

It seems like one of the easier to understand treatments from what I've seen. However, thermodynamics really isn't one of my strong points.

The treatment in this paper winds up with a four-vector to represent "inverse temperature".

Instead of delta-S = Delta-Q / T, one has

delta-S = Energy-momentum-4-vector * inverse-temperature 4-vector

where the product is a "dot" product of two 4-vectors into a scalar.

I can't really comment too much on other versions of relativistic thermodynamics, or their merits and dismerits, or why there is a controversy, unfortunately.

Most textbook treatments I've seen just work the problem in the rest frame of the fluid anyway.
 
Wouldn't temperature reflect the blue-shift/red-shift phenomenon? i.e. Appear hotter coming than going? Or shoujld that be vice-versa, hotter going than coming (as heat is an infrared wavelength)...
 
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There's a book titled Relativity Thermodynamics and Cosmology by Richard C. Tolman that may be available as a Dover reprint from one of the many used book dealers that are online. It's going to be rather dated --it was originally published in 1934. However, it's got some good basic stuff in it if you're really interested in thermodynamics in both Special and General Relativity.
 
Blumfeld: good question! I wish I could think of a good answer!

Because entropy is an invariant it is considered that heat transforms in the same way as temperature does.

I suspect that's a key insight but like other posters my thermodynamics is too limited for me to have an opinion. The question of the link between information entropy and thermodynamic entropy is a hotly debated topic but a first guess is that fast objects are not hotter.

It's interesting to note that an acceleraing frame an observer measures surroundings as HOTTER than a non accelerating observer...this was discussed in another thread here not too long ago.

Wikipedia discusses relativistic heat conduction at :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Relativistic_heat_conduction

And it appears some refinements of that theory might be required.

Roger Penrose notes in THE ROAD TO REALITY that the refinement of thermodynamics is statistical mechanics so that might be an area for further study in answering the question. And in Chapter 27 he discusses even more fundamental "puzzling issues in thermodynamics".
But not explicitly the relationship to relativity.
 

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