How much work to push a spring up/down a distance of y?

AI Thread Summary
The discussion revolves around calculating the work required to displace the midpoint of a spring vertically by a distance y. The relevant formula for work done on a spring, W = -1/2k(b²-a²), is highlighted, but the user struggles to determine the correct values for a and b. They initially attempt to analyze forces and create diagrams but realize that the key concept is the length the spring is stretched, which involves right triangles and Pythagorean theorem. The correct approach involves recognizing that the spring's length changes on both ends, leading to the extended length being 2√(y² + (L/2)²). Ultimately, the user is guided to correctly apply the work formula by considering the total extension of the spring.
Jim01
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Homework Statement



The ends of a relaxed spring of length L and force constant k are attached to two points on two walls separated by a distance L. How much work must you do to push the midpoint of the spring up or down a distance of y?



Homework Equations



W = -1/2k(b2-a2) (after integration), moving from y=a to y=b



The Attempt at a Solution



I'm completely lost on this. The first thing that I notice is that when you push down on the midpoint of the spring, you form two right triangles. This leads me to believe that y will go from a value of zero to the value of Fy, where F is the downward force on the spring. So I made a force diagram and came up with summation of forces.

\sumFx = 0

wx = 0
Fx = L/2

Fx= 0

\sumFy = 0

wy = -mg
N = mg
Fy = -Fcos\theta

wy-N-Fy = 0

Fy = wy-N = -2mg

I attempted to use the Fy value as b in the W = -1/2k(b2-a2) formula but this led me to a wrong answer. I then tried to put Fx into the equation, thinking that maybe I needed to get Fy from the net forces. This led me nowhere either (I was grasping at straws here).


I am obviously going about this the wrong way. Since it involves the work on a spring, I know that I must use the W = -1/2k(b2-a2) formula. I just have no idea how to get the value of b. What concept(s) am I missing here?
 
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There is no need to resolve forces. The crux of the question lies within this: by what length has the spring been stretched? It then results in a clear application of that formula you are brandishing around.
Hint: It involves the right angle triangles you've been talking about and Pythagora's theorem of course
 
Fightfish said:
There is no need to resolve forces. The crux of the question lies within this: by what length has the spring been stretched? It then results in a clear application of that formula you are brandishing around.
Hint: It involves the right angle triangles you've been talking about and Pythagora's theorem of course

I know I'm thickheaded because I'm still not seeing it. If I set the opposite to y, the adjacent to L/2, this gives me a hypotenus of the square root of y2+(L/2)2.

So at rest, the spring length is L. So a=L and b= the square root of y2+(L/2)2. However when I plug this into my formula, it still doesn't work. I end up with

W = -1/2 k [(square root of y2+(L/2)2 - L2]

= - 1/2k [y2+(L/2)2 - L2]

= - 1/2k [y2 - 3/4 L2]

= k(-1/2y2 + 3/8 L2)
 
Last edited:
This is because you forgot to consider the fact that the spring is stretched on both ends. So the length of the extended spring is 2\sqrt{y^2 + (\frac{L}{2})^2}.
 
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